Here's a nit: On page 17 of issue #1, note the time on Adrian Viedt's office building. It says it's ten to midnight. However, after visiting Veidt, Rorschach in his journal entry (page 19) notes the time as being 8:30 p.m. Either Veidt's clock is wrong or Rorschach is wrong. Take your choice. A cerified psycho (Rorschach) or the World's Smartest Man (Veidt).
(And yes, I have started to read the Watchmen TPB.)
Hurm
The newspaper most commonly seen throughout the series is The New York Gazette. Judging by its logo and font, it's The New York Times with a different name. However, in panel three of page four, you can see a bubble gum chewing kid standing in front of a newstand that has a copy of The New York Times. (The headline reads "Vietnam 51st State.")
Panel 2 of page 25 shows Laurie Jupiter (Silk Spectre II) to be left-handed. (She signs a voucher with her left hand.) However, in issue two, she's seen holding flowers for her mom (page 1, panel 2) and lighting a glass pipe (page 2, panel 3) with her right hand. It is, of course, possible that she's ambidextrous.
In issue #2, note the pattern of stars in the canton of the flag laid on the Comedian's casket. It appears that there a four stars on it. However the next time we see the flag (page 12, panel 1) it has 3 stars arranged in a triangle.
Hurm.
In a flashback in #2, the Comedian is seen reading a copy of The New York Gazette (page 9, panel 5). The headline to the paper is on the back page. Shades of Jack Kirby. 
Rorschach has followed Moloch home. Rorschach surprises Moloch by leaping out of his refrigerator. I hope Rorschach wasn't in the fridge too long. Otherwise, he'd've suffocated. (On the other hand, what happened to all the food Moloch had in his fridge? Or was there just not that much in there to begin with?)
Hurm.
The following is a long-time nit I have had about the first issue. (Benn, you wouldn't have noticed because it doesn't become evident until later. Telling it shouldn't spoil anything for you.)
When Rorschach visits Dr. Manhattan and Silk Spectre II to tell them about the Comedian's murder, Dr. Manhattan replies, "Laurie and I were informed xx hours ago." This speech pattern is noticably different from later issues, when Dr. Manhattan often speaks of past events in the present tense.
Benn, is this your first time reading Watchmen?
Oh no. I've read it back in the Eighties. Around the time it came out, at that. I'm re-reading it, though, (now that I have the TPB) with a more critical eye.
Dr. Manhatten's exact words, btw, were "I was informed on Saturday morning." And yeah, I know what you mean about his speech pattern.
Hurm.
Benn: On the other hand, what happened to all the food Moloch had in his fridge?
Look beside the refrigerator in the previous panel. What a mess!
Are you talking about the empty pizza boxes and ice cream cartons, et al? Given that Moloch doesn't seem to notice them, I assumed he was the one responsible for dumping them on the floor. In panel four, Moloch is clearly standing next to the pile, pouring some water into a cup from the sink. Also note that when Rorschach does leap out of the fridge, a bottle of milk* and some eggs fly out, too. On the other hand, there are no racks in the fridge to hold Moloch's food on, so maybe Rorschach did dump it all out on the floor by the sink. But why doesn't Moloch notice this? (Of course, the pizza and ice cream are items that are more properly stored in the freezer unit of the fridge, so Rorschach shouldn't have disturbed them. So...)
Any other opinions?
* It's interesting that in this universe, milk is still available in bottles, whereas in our universe, bottled milk was all but gone by the early Seventies.
Hurm.
On page 1 of issue two, Laurie's skin color is orange/gold. After that (and at most other times in the series) it's the normal flesh tones used for white people.
In panel five of page 8, there's a major color error. Laurie's shirt is pink, while her Mother, Sally, has on a white robe. The actual color scheme shown throughout the rest of this sequence is white blouse for Laurie, pink robe for Sally.
Page 9 and 10 of issue three, shows Dr. Manhattan putting clothes on. Manhattan's powers involve almost absolute control over the molecular structures of just about everything. Why doesn't he create clothing literally out of thin air then? He surely has no need to actually own any clothes, much less anything?
In general, Dr. Manhattan's dialogue balloons are blue in color. However, in panel 3 of page 15 of #3, it's white.
How long is that issue of Tales of the Black Freighter that Bernie reads (issue 3)? It seems to take him several hours to read it. Most individual comics take only about 20 minutes to read. Maybe he's a slow reader...
Some possible DC Comics injokes: On page 9 of #1, look at Hollis Mason's desk closely in panel four. You'll see a lantern that looks very similar to one used by the Green Lantern. One page 19, in the first panel, we see a sign for the Rockefeller Military Research Center. It has a shield on it that looks somewhat like the logo Superman has on his chest. Then in issue three, page 2, panel 2 we see the kid Bernie leaning against one of the power chargers. It has a circle with a lightning bolt going through it - the Flash's chest symbol.
Hurm.
Watchmen #4 centers on Jon Osterman, Dr. Manhattan. In it, he ponders various points of his life, seeing the events as happening in the present. It should be noted that Osterman can also see the future. Yet, none of his reminiscence are on the future. This isn't necessarily a nit, mind you. But it is interesting that Manhattan does not ponder the future as he does the past.
Hurm.
I almost forgot this one - The second part of #4 is the "Introduction" to Professor Milton Glass' book, Dr. Manhattan: Super-Powers and the Superpowers. On page III of the introduction, paragraph 2, is this sentence: "The suggestion that the presence of a superhuman has inclined the world towards more peace is refudiated by..." Is there really such a word as "refudiated"? Or does he mean "repudiated"? I can't find "refudiated" in the dictionary.
Hurm.
Benn said: "How long is that issue of Tales of the Black Freighter that Bernie reads (issue 3)? It seems to take him several hours to read it. Most individual comics take only about 20 minutes to read. Maybe he's a slow reader..."
It's worth noting that in a later issue Bernie said he would reread the issues because he didn't understand them. It's something to keep in mind when reading Watchmen.
Like I've said, I've read this series before. But that was many, many moons ago. It's almost like reading it for the first time now. So, I'm probably overlooking a lot because I just don't remember it. I remember how it ends, though. I also vaguely remember Rorschach's origin story. There's a few other plot points I remember as well. But there are details I've long forgotten. Thanks for the reminder, though, Trike.
Hurm.
I first read the Rohrschach origin story almost 10 years ago, and a scant six months ago, I noticed that buried in the back of the graphic novels section of my local comic book shop (which as since moved to Colfax St., Denver's "red light" district) was the TPB of Watchmen! It was the best graphic novel I had ever read, period!
That said, I'm highly skeptical about this movie. Acocrding to upcomingmovies.com the writer/director of the Watchmen movie (and yes he plans to do it as just ONE movie) is the same guy who co-wrote X-Men and X2 for Bryan Singer (who might be a producer). Now some of his casting choices I like. David Caruso has always been MY first choice to play Rohrscach. Tim Robbins would make a good Night Owl, and Laurence Fishburne as Dr. Manhattan? Yeah, I could see that. But where he loses me is some of his ideas about what gets cut from the movie;
The Comeidan. I'm not kidding. He plans to remove EVERYTHING revolving around this character and just have Rohrshach be looking into the posibility of a "superhero annihilator," but no deaths will be shown, at least in the first part of the movie. Naturally with him goes a whole slew of sub-plots.
Apparently New York will not be the victim of the ultimate plan of Adrian Viedt. I guess after 9/11 this is understandable but it still could wind up losing it's punch. Hell, one rumour has it that Rohrshach and night Owl will actually succeed in STOPPING it in the moive! No, no, no, no, no!!!!! Bad idea!
There are a few others that I've forgotten. I'll get back to this later.
While I can understand the logic behind omitting the Comedian from this film (it won't do to have America's interest preserved by a fascist. Not in this day and age), I think it's a wrong-headed plan. The Comedian is one of the more essential characters to this tale. Without the Comedian, you lose, at the very least, the smiley face with blood splatter icon. Not good.
Nope. I'll ignore this film. Especially considering that the writer of the film (if his X-Men credits are any indications) is a superhero fan. Alan Moore wasn't. And Watchmen was in many ways his indictment of the genre.
No, I'll definitely avoid this movie.
Hurm.
Sounds like they're going to do to it the exact same thing as they did to Moore's League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, namely take out all the dark stuff.
If so, then Rorschach may no longer be the paranoid psycho he is in the series. Which sucks, as that's a key component to the character. Bet he won't be a bum, either.
Hurm.
According to the date of the newspaper, Daily World, we see in the supplemental pages of #9, the original Silk Spectre first appeared in about January of 1939. However, in his memoirs, Under the Hood, Hollis Mason indicates he was the second masked adventurer to arrive on the scene. And he claims to have made his debut in the early months of 1939. His chronology also seems to place Silk Spectre's appearance as about fourth masked adventurer. (That's assuming he's naming the heroes in the order that they first started in #2's supplement.) Now, either the date on the newspaper is wrong, or Hollis' memory is a bit faulty.
Also, Hollis (and others, I believe) refer to the appearances of the masked vigilantes as a "fad". At most, there were eight masked men (and women) operating in New York in the '40s. There is never any indication that there were any other heroes in any other state. Eight people participating in an activity does not constitute a fad, does it?
Those glass things that Laurie and several other characters smoke, I thought they were pipes. Yet in #8, page 4, the first panel, she refers to it as a cigarette. Incidentally, what we normally would call a cigarette still exists in their universe. On pages 8 and 9 of this issue, the detective, Steve, is shown smoking one. (So does Bernard, the kid who reads the Tales of the Black Freighter comic book.)
On page 2 of issue #11, Ozymandias (Adrian Veidt), completes a recording of one of his "obsevations". He gives the time of the recording as "eleven eighteen p.m." New York time. Two panels later, we see a clock that is set for New York time. It clearly gives the time as 11:14. Either "the World's Smartest Man" can't tell time, or he can't set a clock.
Am I the only one who finds it weird that practical everything used in this universe is a Veidt creation? The perfume, shoes, newspapers, the spark plug rechargers... Plus the Gordian Knot Lock Company, probably the Promethean Cab Co., and the Extraspatial Institute are all owned by Veidt. This is almost unbelievable even by today's merger/monopoly standards.
Am I the only who finds it impossible to believe that Ozymandias could actually "catch" a bullet shot at him? I mean, without it being lodged inside his body? (Watchmen #12)
Hurm
I just read your review on the other board. It was excellent.
I was trying to think of a way to counter your assertion that all the superheroes were based in New York. I remembered that Dr. Manhattan obtained his powers in the West ... but later, he fought crime in New York. And, of course, Jon was born in Brooklyn. Good point. I hadn't noticed that before.
My favorite hidden smiley (and the last one I ever found): The cover of Chapter X. In case you didn't know, there are annotations for Watchman available online. They point out many of these hidden, recurring motifs. But even they missed the smiley on the cover of Chapter X.
Good work again! Sheesh. I have a couple TPBs (at least) I could review but have never gotten around to. Maybe your Watchman review will spur me into action.
The radar screen. As a matter of fact, I caught the smiley on the cover of Chapter X as I was re-reading it. It is a very good one.
And yeah, I do know of one of the Annotated Watchmen websites. As I finished a chapter, I read what it had to say about each chapter. I noticed a thing or two it didn't. One that stands out in particularly was on page 8 of Chapter VIII. Look closely at Dan's glasses in panel nine. Doesn't the shadowing around his eyes almost suggest the radiation symbol? This is for me, made even more obvious because of the color used in that panel. The glasses are an orange color.
Thanks for the compliment, btw. Glad you enjoyed the review. I need to finish posting the nits for The Essential Human Torch so I can review it. I'm also in the process of re-reading Maus, so there'll be a review of it, too. (I'm reviewing them in reverse: Maus II, then the first book. Wonderful.)
I'm thinking about going through the Watchmen series and listing some of the hidden motifs that I've found.
Exelsior!
Here are some of the things of note in the first chapter of Watchmen:
The cover of course, features the first appearance of the blood covered smiley face. This is one of the most important recurring motifs in the series.
On page 1, panel, we see the first appearance of the man with the sign saying, "The End Is Near". Panel 5 shows the first appearance of the triangle.
On page 2, the ninth panel, is a picture of the Comedian with Vice-President Ford. We will see the moment this photo is taken in a flashback sequence in Chapter IX, on page 20. (It's the second panel.)
Page 3, panel 3 shows how the blood got on the smiley button. Panel 6 shows the first appearance of the glass pipes with a ball on them. They seem to come in two or three different designs.
Note that on 4, panel 1 that the express elevator skips from the 2nd floor to the 23rd.
Panel 3 shows the first appearance of the comic book Tales of the Black Freighter. This comic provides many important commentaries on the actions seen throughout the series. Also, there are other comic books seen in the background. One is called Pirates, the other, {X-Ships}. (A tribute to the X-Men?) The New York Times headline is "Vietnam 51st State." Note that for much of the rest of the series, The New York Times has been renamed The New York Gazette. The Times will appear again, but only in a flashback sequence. Never in a "current" sequence. And finally, the hat the kid blowing bubblegum is wearing has a triangle in it.
Panel five introduces many of the recurring elements of the series. A blimp can be seen in the upper right hand corner. We see for the first time Gunga Diner. This restaurant is apparently the Watchmen Universe version of McDonald's.
In the lower right hand corner, a Top Knot can be seen. This is either a fashion trend, a gang, or an indication that the person is a fan of the band, Pale Horse.
The woman in green and her daughter will be seen again later. They walk past a sign advertising Mmeltdown candy. a bit of foreshadowing here, folks.
The price on the taxi cab is twenty five cents. Per mile?
The man with the sign can also be on the right.
The seventh panel has the triangle symbol in it. It's on a truck in the background.
Hey! It just occured to me. If you stand the smiley button right side up and think of the blood splatter as the big hand on a clock, then it's the same position as the big hand on the clock on the cover of Chapter I!
Notice the man with the sign and where he's walking. Compare that with the first panel of page 5. Hint, hint.
Above Rorschach in the first panel are a blimp and another ad for Mmeltdowns.
Panel three, Rorschach picks up the Comedian's smiley face button out of the gutter.
In panel eight, a geodesic dome can be seen.
Another blimp can be seen in the first panel of page 6.
Page 8, panel 7 - the first appearance of the Minutemen photo. This will appear many times in the series.
On page nine, note the time on Hollis Mason's clock in panel 3. Mason is the original Nite Owl. He is talking to Daniel Drieberg, his successor, Nite Owl II.
In panel five, look for what looks like the Green Lantern's power lamp, the retirement statue Hollis received (it says, "In Gratitude") and the books in the foreground. They are: 2 copies of Mason's memoirs Under the Hood, a book on Automobile Maintenance and Philip K. Wylie's novel, Gladiator. Gladiator was one of the inspirations for the creation of Superman.
In panel 7 we see for the first time the name of the band, Pale Horse. But more importantly we see the grafitti, "Who Watches the Watchmen?" This phrase is never seen whole. It is always incomplete.
In panel 8, the sign to Mason's Auto Shop says, "Obsolete Models a Specialty." A bit of symbolism, eh?
Page 10, panel 1. More top knots. The tall one is Derf. (Not our fellow nitpicker, I hope!) We'll see him again later. The newspaper's headline is "Russians Protest US Adv... In Afghanistan."
Panel two shows us the first ad for Nostalgia perfume and the first appearance of the Treasure Island comics shop.
In the seventh panel, notice that the calendars in this universe start on Mondays. Panel 8 shows another difference with this universe: The Heinz company advertizes 58 varieties.
Page 11 is when Daniel obtains the Comedian's smiley button. In the fifth panel, we see Rorschach take some of Dreiberg's Sweet Chariot sugar cubes. This will come into play later in the series.
Panel 8: The first appearance of Daniel's Nite Owl lair and his airship, Archie.
On page 12, the third through fifth panels show that the patterns on Rorschach's mask do not stay the same. Panel 7 shows us our first glimpse of Daniel's Nite Owl costume.
A nit. In panel one of page 13, the costume is miscolored white. It should be brown.
By the end of page 13, Daniel has cleaned the blood stain from the smiley button.
In panel one of page 14, Rorschach sits in front of a geodesic dome. Panel four has a poster saying "Stick With Dick In '84." This is the first clue we have as to the political landscape of this universe. The next panel shows the bar Happy Harry's for the first time. In the final panel, look for the woman smoking the curved pipe. It's an unusual design for the series. Page 16, panel 5 shows a pipe with two spheres on it.
Page 17, panel one shows another blimp. Panel two a glimpse of the poster announcing Ozyandias' India Famine Relief Performance. It's seen more clearly in the sixth panel.
Look carefully in the second panel and you can see Rorschach grappling hook. This is how he entered Adrian Veidt's (Ozymandias) offices. Also, in the sixth panel showing the Famine Relief poster, note the Veidt logo. It shows up a lot in the series.
Panel 4 of page 18 shows a blimp, a geodesic dome and a New York Gazette. The headlines on it are "Nuclear Clock stands at Five to Twelve Warn Experts" and "Geneva Talks: U.S. Refuses to Discuss Dr. Manhattan."
The shield of the Rockefeller Military Research Center looks very similar to Superman's logo.
Note that on page 21, panels six and seven, Rorschach is seen unwrapping and eating a cube of Sweet Chariot sugar.
In the final panel of page 22, Rorschach says, "Hurm" for the first time.
Page 24, panel 1: There is a poster for an upcoming Pale Horse concert. The graffiti say "Krystalnacht" (the opening act at the Pale Horse concert), "One in Eight Go Mad", an anarchy symbol and another incomplete "Who Wathces the Watchmen" slogan. In the trash can is a Gunga Diner box.
Panel 4 shows a couple embracing. This is also a recurring visual cue.
The seventh panel shows a campaign poster for Nixon, saying "Four More Years".
Sorry, Laurie is not left handed. A closer look at panel two of page 25, reveals she is signing the check with her right hand.
Look at panel 4. You see two men, who are clearly lovers, holding hands. On the left is a four legged chicken.
A geodesic dome can be glimpsed in the next panel.
Like page one, the last page, page 26, focuses on the Comedian's smiley badge and pulls up to a long shot in at the bottom of the page.
The next six pages are exerpts from Hollis Mason's book, Under the Hood.
Well, should I continue? Or am I being too pedantic?
Hurm.
Here's how I could see it working as a trilogy of movies:
Part I gets its title from Chapter I:
Watchmen – At Midnight, All the Agents…
Ch1:
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover for opening. Opening credits as camera slowly zooms out up building. “Sandwich board guy” seen.
• Detectives investigate Edward Blake’s murder.
• Rorschach investigates and discovers that Blake is the Comedian.
• Dan Dreiberg visits with Hollis Mason. Possibly add some content from Under the Hood into their conversation before Dan leaves.
• Rorschach warns Dan of mask killer theory.
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover as he heads to bar.
• Rorschach makes the rounds to Happy Harry’s,
• Rorschach warns Adrian Veidt of his theory and then tries to warn Jon & Laurie Juspeczyk.
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover as he walks home.
• Dan and Laurie go out to dinner.
Ch2:
• Laurie visits mother – Flashback to attempted rape.
• Funeral
-Veidt’s flashback to Crimebusters meeting.
-Jon’s flashback to Vietnam.
-Dan’s flashback to riot.
• “Sandwich board guy” seen outside funeral, mysterious figure leaves roses.
• Rorschach drops in on Moloch – Moloch recounts visit from the Comedian.
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover while he visits Blake’s grave juxtaposed with silent flashes of Blake’s murder.
(*)If any subplot can be cut, it is the pirate comic and the news vendor’s conversations with the comic book reader. These could be added back, but I’m leaving them out. It is probably the least vital subplot, and also the one most difficult to translate to the screen.
Ch3:
• News vendor talks to “Sandwich board guy” about the end of the world.
• Laurie and Jon get into their big fight.
• Jenny Slater talks to Nova Express reporter.
• Laurie visits Dan about leaving Jon.
• Jon’s television interview juxtaposed with Dan and Laurie’s attempted mugging.
• Jon teleports audience away, leaves for Arizona, and then leaves for Mars.
• Rorschach, Dan, and Laurie learn of Jon’s disappearance.
Ch5:
• Rorschach visits Moloch again to ask about Jon.
• Detectives from start of film are investigating murder scene.
• Assassination attempt is made on Veidt.
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover as he gets Moloch’s message.
• Detectives given tip about “Raw Shark.”
• Rorschach’s setup, fight with police, and arrest. He is unmasked and revealed as the sandwich board guy.
Ch3:
• Nixon and advisors discuss the threat of nuclear war juxtaposed with images of Jon on Mars.
• Text on screen: Shall not the judge of all earth do right? --GENESIS chapter 18, verse 25
• End credits.
This makes for a solid ending to a film, with Rorschach being arrested at the climax, and the film closes with a sense of impending doom.
Part II gets its title from Chapter 6:
Watchmen – The Abyss Gazes Also
Ch 6:
• Possible added introduction for Dr. Malcolm and his wife during opening credits.
• Follow the entire chapter as close to a direct adaptation as possible.
• Ends with the line: “We are alone. There is nothing else.”
Ch4:
• Jon is on Mars experiencing various periods of time.
• Follow the entire chapter as close to a direct adaptation as possible.
Ch7:
• Laurie is in Owl’s Nest; Dan thinks she is being attacked by mask killer.
• Dan and Laurie discuss Owl’s Nest and the past.
• Dan and Laurie attempt to make love juxtaposed with sounds and images from the television in the background.
• Dan’s dream.
• Dan and Laurie suit up; Nite-Owl and Silk Spectre save tenants from fire.
• Dan and Laurie succeed in making love, then decide to spring Rorschach.
Ch8:
• Hollis Mason calls Sally Jupiter about fire rescue. Kids are seen trick-or-treating.
• Dan and Laurie plan jailbreak.
• Big Figure and goons threaten Rorschach in prison.
• Detective visits Dan.
• New Frontiersman editor putting together Honor is like the Hawk –and- Missing Writer.
• Artists on island discuss “special effect.”
• Hollis carves pumpkin while watching New Frontiersman vs. Nova Express on television.
• Knot-heads at newsstand hear about tenant building rescue, figure that Nite-Owl was behind it.
• Nite-Owl and Silk Spectre break into prison to rescue Rorschach as Rorschach is fighting Big Figure and his goons.
• Heroes make their escape in Archie.
• Knot-heads kill Hollis, thinking he was the Nite-Owl who rescued the tenants.
• Heroes return to Dan’s apartment, where Jon is waiting for Laurie.
• Jon teleports away with Laurie as police kick down Dan’s door.
• Nite-Owl and Rorschach escape in Archie just ahead of the cops.
Ch 10:
• President and VP are brought to military complex with launch whatsit chained to Nixon’s wrist.
• Last lines of the film: “What do we do next?” “We do what we came down here for: We stay at Defcon Two…and we sit…and we wait.”
• Text on screen: Outside in the distance a wild cat did growl, two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl. –Bob Dylan
• End credits.
The second film, like the first, closes with a sense of impending doom from nuclear war, this time worse than the last. The film comes to its climax with Rorschach’s escape from prison. In terms of our heroes, this film ends on a more hopeful note than the previous film, although they are separated at the end. In terms of the whole global situation, it ends on a more hopeless note than the last film.
Part III gets its title from Chapter 11:
Watchmen – Look On My Works, Ye Mighty
Ch10:
• Veidt arrives at his Antarctic base and is greeted by three servants. He changes into his Ozymandias costume and begins monitoring a large wall of TV screens. Opening credits during this.
Ch 9:
• Laurie and Jon are on Mars. Laurie is challenged to convince Jon that humanity is worth saving.
• Follow the entire chapter as close to a direct adaptation as possible.
Ch10:
• Dan and Rorschach retrieve spare Rorschach clothes and face.
• Dan and Rorschach wait in Archie under the river, arguing over the mystery.
• Dan and Rorschach go to Happy Harry’s for information, where Dan learns of Hollis’s murder.
• Kidnapped artists and scientists are sent away on a ship rigged with explosives.
• Dan and Rorschach break into Veidt’s office and discover his involvement in the “mask killer” case.
• Rorschach’s journal voiceover – then he mails it to “the only people he can trust.”
• New Frontiersman editor receives Rorschach’s journal and has Seymour put it on the crank file.
• Archie is flying over Antarctica when it freezes up and crashes in the snow.
• Ozymandias spots Nite-Owl and Rorschach approaching on his monitors.
Ch11:
• Ozymandias arms machine and calls assistants into the Vivarium to celebrate.
• Ozy tells his life story before opening the dome to kill his assistants.
• Nite-Owl and Rorschach break in and attack Ozymandias, but he beats them.
• Ozymandias explains his master plan with various flashbacks.
• Nite-Owl and Rorschach do not believe his story.
• Clock strikes midnight and the “alien” is teleported to New York.
Ch12:
• Grotesque images of the aftermath.
• Jon and Laurie arrive in New York. Laurie is sickened, and Jon is intrigued by the muddling of his senses, but traces the source to Antarctica.
• Ozymandias explains the last details to Dan and Rorschach. Dan is disbelieving, but Rorschach is convinced.
• Jon and Laurie arrive in Antarctica.
• Jon learns of Veidt’s plan and goes after him, walking into Ozy’s intrinsic field trap which atomizes Jon.
• Laurie sneaks up behind Ozymandias and shoots him, but he spins around and catches the bullet.
• Dr. Manhattan reforms from Veidt’s attack and crashes through the wall.
• Veidt plays all the news channels on his wall of televisions, learning that all nations are agreeing to put aside their differences to face the alien threat.
• Jon recognizes that they must do nothing or risk losing the peace created by Veidt’s plan, and Dan and Laurie hesitantly agree.
• Rorschach storms out, unwilling to compromise his beliefs.
• As Dan and Laurie make love, Jon tries to stop Rorschach and has to kill him.
• Jon leaves an ominous message for Veidt before leaving for another galaxy.
• “Mr. and Mrs. Hollis” visit Sally Jupiter.
• New York has been put back in order and there are various signs that fences have been mended with Russia.
• To fill the paper, the New Frontiersman editor tells Seymour to run something from the crank file, which Rorschach’s journal is seen on top of.
• Text on screen: It would be a stronger world, a stronger loving world, to die in.
--John Cale
• End Credits.
I think those are great ideas.
A Watchman comic inspired by Garfield Minus Garfield.
All I get is a blank page when I click on it.
It works for me.
I just finished this.
Possibly the most theme-driven story I’ve ever read, and pretty slowly paced. There’s no reason that this had to take twelve issues to tell. I like theme and subtext as much as the next guy, but Alan Moore practically beats you over the head with it as a lead pipe, and it slows down the actual narrative. I didn’t see what Tales of the Black Freighter had to do with the Watchmen story, and the ubiquity of the newsstand vendor scenes just got me impatient after a while. This and other things just bogged down the story, while adding nothing to it. The last four pages of issue #10, for example, which depicted in painful detail Nite Owl and Rorschach approaching Ozymandias’ Antarctic headquarters, observing how the cold was affecting the Archimedes, getting the hover bikes, etc., could’ve been done in one page, two tops.
The ending was also difficult to accept. These guys are supposed to be heroes, yet even though Ozymandias kills three million New Yorkers, as well as one of their comrades, and the others decide to cover it up simply because it gets governments to cease hostilities and work together because of a perceived extraterrestrial threat? Ozymandias doesn’t really seem like the smartest man in the world if he thinks that that “peace” will outlast that so-called threat. Once the “alien” problem is resolved, the governments will go right back to working towards their own interests, and against each other. And the only person against this plan was the sociopathic right-wing vigilante bully who attacked and seriously injured police officers? And Dr. Manhattan kills him because Ozymandias’ plan actually reignites his interest in humanity? I know that Alan Moore wanted to examine how people who became costumed adventurers might actually behave in real life, but did it not occur to him that anyone other than a maniac like Rorschach might exhibit some heroic, moral objection to all of this?
There was some good characters stuff, particularly Dr. Manhattan and Rorschach, but overall, it was an okay story marred by having taken too long to be told, and by an absolutely awful coloring job.
---NITS:
In issue #4, Dr. Manhattan teleports all the protestors outside the White House to their homes. He says he learned in the paper the next day that two people suffered heart attacks after suddenly finding themselves indoors. But if he exists outside of linear time, as he has explained, being able to see the past, present and future simultaneously (kinda like the Prophets on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, couldn’t he simply have teleported everyone but those several people?
In issue #7, when Dreiberg/Nite Owl II is showing Laurie/Silk Spectre II around inside in the Archimedes, or “Archie”, she observes that its design incorporates only curves, with no corners, which he says is to help make it invisible to radar. But there are corners all over the shiip in the panel in which they say this, as well as in the panels immediately before and after it! Did Dave Gibbons not read that part of the script? Or did Alan Moore only think of this after it had already been drawn?
Benn: Rorschach has followed Moloch home. Rorschach surprises Moloch by leaping out of his refrigerator. I hope Rorschach wasn't in the fridge too long. Otherwise, he'd've suffocated. (On the other hand, what happened to all the food Moloch had in his fridge? Or was there just not that much in there to begin with?
Luigi Novi: When reading it, I assumed he took out all the shelves and food, and stashed them somewhere where Moloch wouldn't see them. I didn't even notice that the previous panel, as S. Donaldson pointed out, showed exactly that. It's not just the food. Shelves are shown too. And Moloch is not standing next to that pile. He is in the background, whereas the pile is in the foreground, which is why they're colored differently. As for suffocation, I figure Rorschach got in only when he heard Moloch come home.
Benn: On page 9 of #1, look at Hollis Mason's desk closely in panel four. You'll see a lantern that looks very similar to one used by the Green Lantern.
Luigi Novi: It’s his mantle, actually. (Pick, pick, pick!)
Benn: Also, Hollis (and others, I believe) refer to the appearances of the masked vigilantes as a "fad". At most, there were eight masked men (and women) operating in New York in the '40s. There is never any indication that there were any other heroes in any other state. Eight people participating in an activity does not constitute a fad, does it?
Luigi Novi: What indicated that the only ones mentioned were the only ones there were?
Benn: Those glass things that Laurie and several other characters smoke, I thought they were pipes. Yet in #8, page 4, the first panel, she refers to it as a cigarette. Incidentally, what we normally would call a cigarette still exists in their universe. On pages 8 and 9 of this issue, the detective, Steve, is shown smoking one. (So does Bernard, the kid who reads the Tales of the Black Freighter comic book.)
Luigi Novi: That long thing she holds when smoking is a cigarette holder. The actual cigarette is on the end of it.
Benn: Am I the only who finds it impossible to believe that Ozymandias could actually "catch" a bullet shot at him? I mean, without it being lodged inside his body? (Watchmen #12)
Luigi Novi: Is it possible that, aside from Dr. Manhattan (the only character who clearly has superhuman abilities, at least overt ones), that some have near-superhuman abilities like Captain America?
In issue #4, Dr. Manhattan teleports all the protestors outside the White House to their homes. He says he learned in the paper the next day that two people suffered heart attacks after suddenly finding themselves indoors. But if he exists outside of linear time, as he has explained, being able to see the past, present and future simultaneously (kinda like the Prophets on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, couldn’t he simply have teleported everyone but those several people?
When he's on Mars he explains to Laurie that even though he can see events he cannot alter them because it would change the fabric of the universe (that's not the exact quote but it's something like that). Similarly he says the same thing when asked in a flashback why he didn't stop the assasination of JFK. Doc Manhatten doesn't see the universe as we do he sees it as its basic component parts- basically a whole bunch of circuits and molecules, that's why Laurie has such a problem with him on Mars.
I should mention Luigi, that if you felt the GN stalled a lot then you'll enjoy the quicker pace of the film which chops all of that black freighter stuff.
What indicated that the only ones mentioned were the only ones there were? - Luigi
What indicates otherwise? Nowhere in the story is it even hinted that there are other heroes elsewhere in the Watchmen Universe. Certainly the Russian did not have any. The only evidence we have throughout the series is that the Minutemen and Crimebusters were it.
That long thing she holds when smoking is a cigarette holder. The actual cigarette is on the end of it. - Luigi
You sure about that? Look at issue #2, page 1, panel 8. Either Laurie is putting a round filter into the holder or it's (as I've assumed) tobacco.
Is it possible that, aside from Dr. Manhattan (the only character who clearly has superhuman abilities, at least overt ones), that some have near-superhuman abilities like Captain America? - Luigi
Possible, but there's not anything in the series to indicate this is so. But remember, Laurie was very surprised that Adrian could catch the bullet. She didn't suspect he'd be able to. Besides, even with his "near-superhuman abilities", Captain America needs his shield to save him from bullets.
But there are corners all over the shiip in the panel in which they say this, as well as in the panels immediately before and after it! - Luigi
You need to look at the previous two panels and the ones after a little more closely. The walls are shown to have a bit of a gentle curve to them.
But if he exists outside of linear time, as he has explained, being able to see the past, present and future simultaneously (kinda like the Prophets on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, couldn’t he simply have teleported everyone but those several people? - Luigi
I've always taken Dr. Manhattan's attitude to be that he sees in the future is inalterable. It's going to happen. It's not a possible future. It's the only future he sees. Therefore if he what he sees happening in the future is him giving people heart attacks by teleporting them, then that is just exactly what's supposed to happen.
Sorry you didn't like Watchmen. I still feel it's a classic of the comics genre (I take it you've hated all the decompressed stories of the last ten years or so). And BTW, why didn't you post your review on the review board and your nits here?
For more info on the Tales of the Black Freighter subplot of Watchmen and what significance it's supposed to have to the story, go here.
The fact that other adventurers are not mentioned can hardly be taken as evidence of the negative.
Good point about Oz and the bullet.
I indeed looked at the panels closely, which is how I noticed the nit, and looking at them again (and other shots) confirms it.
Two panels before Laurie makes the comment about no corners, she and Dan are holding hands. Look at the ceiling. Corners.
In the panel right after Laurie makes that comment, look at the background showing the wall panel and doorway behind Dan. Corners.
In the last panel of the page, look at the door behind Laurie. Corners.
For that matter, look at the large, rectangular part of the Archimedes' exterior in between the two eyes, like for example, on Page 19 of issue #7. Look at how the side facing away from the cockpit and the sides perpendicular to it come to a point. That's a corner.
Or look at the control panels and floor panels on Page 2 of the same issue, panels 1, 2, 4 & 5. Corners.
Benn: I take it you've hated all the decompressed stories of the last ten years or so..
Luigi Novi: You take it wrong. The pacing is one of the problems I cited with Watchmen, but not the only one, and IMO, was not justified by the story. The "decompression" in The Authority, on the other hand, certainly allows the action and the story to breathe, and I never would've even observed it to be "decompressed" but if not for observations by industry pundits to that effect. Just because I thought an aspect of Watchmen was not well done doesn't mean that therefore, ipso facto, I don't like it when other creators attempt to apply that principle.
In any event, if you liked Watchmen, then cool beans.
Two panels before Laurie makes the comment about no corners, she and Dan are holding hands. Look at the ceiling. Corners. - Luigi
Look further in the background. At the blue wall. There's a slight curve drawn to it.
In the last panel of the page, look at the door behind Laurie. Corners. - Luigi
That's a panel. Not a wall you're pointing at.
In the last panel of the page, look at the door behind Laurie. Corners. - Luigi
Look a little further in the upper left and you'll see it's starting to curve there.
For that matter, look at the large, rectangular part of the Archimedes' exterior in between the two eyes, like for example, on Page 19 of issue #7. Look at how the side facing away from the cockpit and the sides perpendicular to it come to a point. That's a corner. - Luigi
Or look at the control panels and floor panels on Page 2 of the same issue, panels 1, 2, 4 & 5. Corners. - Luigi
So, you're counting the corners in the paneling, eh? I kinda took it that Laurie was talking about the general shape of Archie particularly the exterior of the ship. Dan's immediate reply about the ship being invisible to radar seems to confirm this. The corner on the prow of Archie wouldn't hinder the invisibility.
The fact that other adventurers are not mentioned can hardly be taken as evidence of the negative. - Luigi
And the reverse is equally true. It would have been very easy for Alan Moore to throw in a line in say, Mason's Under the Hood that mentions the fad being national or referencing, even in passing, that heroes were in other cities. Moore tends to be very detailed oriented and precise in his writing. The fact that he omitted any reference to heroes existing outside New York City indicates to me that there wasn't any.
Benn: Look further in the background. At the blue wall. There's a slight curve drawn to it.
Luigi Novi: So what? I didn't say there were no curves, only that the statement that it's all curves is wrong. That ceiling is filled with corners. And look at where the ceiling meets that wall you mention. That point is a corner.
Benn: That's a panel. Not a wall you're pointing at. Look a little further in the upper left and you'll see it's starting to curve there.
Luigi Novi: Again, I'm not debating that. I'm talking about that 90 degree corner that the yellow arrow is directly pointing at. That's a corner. First of all, how do you know that's a panel and not a door? For that matter, even if we assume it'a panel, so what? Couldn't the panels be determined by the shape of the bulkheads themselves atop which the panels rest? The point is that they said there were no corners. They didn't say "There are no corners, except for panels." They said no corners. That's a corner. I even openly mentioned control panels as corners, so I'm not sure why you're implying that panels somehow don't count.
Benn: So, you're counting the corners in the paneling, eh? I kinda took it that Laurie was talking about the general shape of Archie particularly the exterior of the ship. Dan's immediate reply about the ship being invisible to radar seems to confirm this. The corner on the prow of Archie wouldn't hinder the invisibility.
Luigi Novi: Yes, I'm counting the panels, but how does this pertain to the "prow"? That's not a panel, that is part of the ship's exterior structure! Just as the points at which the floors, walls and ceiling meet. And how do you know the prow wouldn't hinder its invisibility?
Benn: And the reverse is equally true.
Luigi Novi: Except no one here is asserting the reverse. In other words, I never asserted to know that there were other adventurers. There may be, or there may not be. My point is that only you are asserting that one or the other can be concluded. My point is that either is possible, and neither is explicitly indicated either way. The fact that Moore is detailed in his writing doesn't mean he's going to go out of his way to plug up loose areas that nitpickers exploit for discussion. That's not the role of writers.
Okay, so I'm wrong on everything.
You were not wrong about Oz and the bullet, and I noted that.
I’ve never understood it when creators fail to give at least somewhat distinctive names to places. This occurred frequently with regard to cities and planetary capitals on Star Trek. A friend of mine even made a comic book which depicted a police station with a sign that simply said “Police” or “Police Station” on it. The Naked Gun even poked fun at this by depicting the sign over a hospital entrance read simply “The Hospital”. In this book, the sign over the cemetery entrance during Blake’s funeral simply says—you guessed it—“Cemetary”. Not “Green Lawn Cemetary” or “Happy Trails Cemetary” or anything. Why not call it something like “River Styx Cemetary” or “Osiris Cemetary”, since those are names associated with ancient Egyptian death customs, and Ozymandias was the one who killed Blake. The panel in which the sign is seen is really small, and the sign itself is really small and seen from inside the cemetery (backwards), so it wouldn’t be that obvious.
Given how out of shape Nite Owl is depicted to be, how is he able to be such an effective fighter against opponents who appear to be in such better shape?
Were Moore or Gibbons attempting to tie some homosexual subtext to Veidt or Pyramid industries by making its logo a pink triangle? Or is the story set in some universe or continuity in which the Nazis did not use pink triangles for homosexual concentration camp prisoners, and it therefore was not appropriated by gays as a symbol of pride?
Janey Slater accuses Dr. Manhattan of “chasing jailbait” with Laurie, because, according to her, she’s getting older while he’s still 30. Jon agrees with this, at least internally. But why would this matter to someone like him who’s so disconnected from humanity?
Also on the issue of corners in the Archimedes, the presence of corners would not, in and of themselves, make a ship visible to radar. It’s the angle and arrangement of the facets, or surfaces, on which they appear, the formulas and math for which was discovered by Petr Ufimtsev. This is seen dramatically when one looks at the Stealth Figher, which is loaded with angles. (And even then, it only reduces its radar cross-section. It doesn't make it completely invisible to detection, but makes it smaller enough to make it indistinguishable from smaller objects like birds.)
At one point, Laurie is wearing some dopey-looking pink suit with a white smock or something over it. She and Dan make love, and when she wakes up, she goes down to his basement lair, where she tells him to suit up while she gets dressed so they can take Archie out for spin. She comes back in a trench coat, and they take Archie out. She removes the trench coat, and she’s wearing her Silk Spectre II costume. Why did she have the trench coat over it?
Okay, so Kovacs ties together the hands of Larry, the fat convict who comes to his prison cell with the dwarf. His fellow con says they can’t reach the lock of the cell. The dwarf orders Larry’s colleague to kill him, and he does so, slitting his throat. But how does this get them access to the lock? All it does it make the problem worse! (In the movie, they fix this problem, by having them cut off Larry’s forearms with a chainsaw, which actually does cause him to fall away from the cell, thus uncovering the lock.)
When Nite Owl guesses “Rameses” as Ozymandias’ computer password, the computer tells him it’s incomplete, and asks him if he wishes to add to this. Why would a computer do this? All it does it indicate to an intruder trying to guess the password that they’re on the right track, and allow them to narrow it down to something more specific, which is exactly what Nite Owl does when he adds “II” to the password.
Okay, so why exactly does Ozymandias kill all those men in his “Vivarium”?
Why does Rorschach remove his mask at the end of the film right before Dr. Manhattan kills him? Throughout the book it is established that he considers his mask to be his “face”, and his real face to be a mask. Doing this is the equivalent for Rorschach of putting on a mask. Why would he do this?
When Jon completely reforms his body for the first time as Dr. Manhattan before the Rockefeller staff and Janey, Janey immediately recognizes him as Jon, despite the fact that he’s bald, blue, glowing, hovering a few feet in the air, has white eyes, no pupils, and black stuff around his eyes. Wow! And I thought I was good with faces!
Rorschach sneaks past a couple of guards at Rockefeller, and loudly breaks the glass window of a door, and no one hears? Are the guards completely out of earshot? Is no one else around? If Rorschach is so tactically brilliant and skilled, shouldn't he have used a glass cutter or lockpick?
quote:Luigi Novi: Janey Slater accuses Dr. Manhattan of “chasing jailbait” with Laurie, because, according to her, she’s getting older while he’s still 30. Jon agrees with this, at least internally. But why would this matter to someone like him who’s so disconnected from humanity?
quote:Luigi Novi:
Okay, so why exactly does Ozymandias kill all those men in his “Vivarium”?
quote:Luigi Novi: Why does Rorschach remove his mask at the end of the film right before Dr. Manhattan kills him? Throughout the book it is established that he considers his mask to be his “face”, and his real face to be a mask. Doing this is the equivalent for Rorschach of putting on a mask. Why would he do this?
So you've seen the film now Luigi?
DC to publish Watchemen prequels. I think I'll avoid these. First of all, these are Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons' creations. Second of all, I think the Watchmen story has already been told. No need to follow it up. This is just DC trying to milk this cow some more. Pass.
DC to publish Watchemen prequels
Wouldn't that just be reprints of Captain Atom, The Question, Blue Beetle, etc. ;-)
these are Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons' creations
Wellllll... recreations, anyway... ;-)
Some interesting talent involved though.
Still I think Cooke dropped the ball on Silk Spectre. He wants her to be an independent heroine whereas Watchman showed her as just the girlfriend to Manhatten & later Nite Owl. I think that really is all there is to her. First her mother pushes her to follow in her footsteps, then she becomes a "hanger-on"/girlfriend to two different former heroes. If she had been independent she probably would have developed her own superhero identity, not been pushed into one.
Thinking about it a Dr. Manhattan series seems rather pointless.
IIRC Manhattan saw everything he was to do & did it. No attempt to change things & even saying things that he knew would be false because he knew what the outcome would be (i.e. telling Laurie that he thought she might enjoy the multiple Manhattans even though he knew that it would end up freaking her out).
So with no possibility of character change, or learning, the only possible story would be his effect on those around him which seems like it would be dull & boring stretched out over 4 issues.
For that matter Manhattan in Watchmen is odd given that he's just doing & saying what he saw & heard himself saying, since it becomes a paradox. He says & does what he saw himself saying & doing it, so where did the original idea to do those things come from?
(Besides Alan Moore. ;-))
For that matter he had to know exactly what Ozymandious was up to because he should have seen the resolution of it. However it just didn't matter to him to change anything. *shakes head*
Comics Should Be Good has a recurring feature The Line It Is Drawn & the subject was "After Watchmen" & they used one of my suggestions.