The "Favorite Concept Album" coversation pretty much derailed over them, so I figgured that they ought to have their own subject!

Well, If nobody else is going to pick up on this, I will. My collection of The Who is still a bit young, but I'm working on it. I've got A Quick One, The Who Sell Out, Who's Next, Quadrophenia and a greatest hits CD; plus the origional Tommy LPs (with book!)

As I already siad several times before, I really think that The Who's peak was with Sell Out. However, rather than continue to pick on that, I'll move on too Who's Next. I agree that it has it's moments, but I would hardly jump on the bandwagon and call it their "greatest". Sure, "Baba O'Riely", "Behind Blue Eyes", and "Won't Get Fooled Again" are classics, but would you venture the same definition to "Getting In Tune" or "The Song Is Over"? I wouldn't. Also, the sadly common lack of John's songwriting is even worse here, with only "My Wife" showing up (I will always prefer him to Pete). Finally, the production leave a bit to be desired. I've never been a big fan of synth, so I don't really welcome it's presence here. "Love Ain't Of Keeping" (and probobly "Goin' Mobile") should have been electric. Of course, like any post-Sell Out work, the lack of their early harmonys is fatal (aside from "Behind Blue Eyes", which is why it's so good).

Still, there are some good left unsaid. I think that several of the bonus tracks beat the pants off of the origional album's line up. "Baby, Don't You Do It" is one of the band's best proformances, and "Naked Eye" and "Water" are awe inspiering. True, the choice to end with the earlier version of "Behind Blue Eyes" is dumb, but not fatal.

Oh god. Lemme medititate on this one, Blitz. I ain't ready yet to mount a defense of Who's Next. Yesterday, I was up almost 24 hours. I didn't wake 'til about midnight, and I'm still barely awake. That's why I've kept my most recent posts fairly short, and without a whole lot of thought to 'em. You'll hear from this. I promise. (Unless someone else goes to bat for me.)

Oh god. Lemme medititate on this one, Blitz. I ain't ready yet to mount a defense of Who's Next. Yesterday, I was up almost 24 hours. I didn't wake 'til about midnight, and I'm still barely awake. That's why I've kept my most recent posts fairly short, and without a whole lot of thought to 'em. You'll hear from me on this. I promise. (Unless someone else goes to bat for me.)

Sleep. There's always time to rant latter.

Thanks, Blitz.

Now for the rant. |cackles evilly to himself|

When I look at my top ten favorite bands, three acts stick out. The Kinks, The Who and The Monkees. The all three have something in common other than being from the Sixties with ties to England: they have band members who don't get along with each other. The brothers Davies, Ray and Dave, of The Kinks were notorious for it. Calling it sibling rivalry makes it sound cute. It's like calling what Cain and Abel had "sibling rivalry". They could've killed each other.

Then The Monkees, they certainly weren't four friends sharing a beach pad. Mike has called them "comrades-in-arms". Micky compared their relationship to survivors of a plane crash. There's a special bond, yeah. But both gentlemen have denied the Pre Fab Four are buddies.

The Who. |cackling evilly again| Wooboy! Four very different individuals with little in common, but the creature known as "The Who". Roger, Keith, Pete and John. The battles with these four are legendary. Roger even decked Towser on one occassion. God knows how many times they came to breaking up, only to patch things all for the sake of the Beast called "The Who". Almost as many times as The Fantastic Four have split up.

I mention this because I think it's funny that you lament the loss of vocal harmonies after The Who Sell Out. It's funny because The Who were (are? It's hard to say that they no longer exist.) never a harmonious band. It's the violence and chaos that always made The Who great.

Roger was originally The Who's leader. Then Townshend started writing songs. Good songs. Great songs. Anthems. Towser was now in charge of the band.

Kit Lambert begin to encourage Pete to write operatic rock song. Townshend, one of dozens of former art school students in rock, found the idea appealing. This resulted, first, in the song, "A Quick One, While He's Away", a nine minute epic mini-opera. The next album would feature "Rael", and would be, overall, a concept album. But The Who Sell Out is Townshend still groping, learning his way. He is still developing as a songwriter.

The Who, up to this point, were heavily in debt. Smashing guitars and drum sets at every show was an expensive hobby. None of their albums had sold that well. They needed a break-out album. They got it.

For about a year, Townshend was telling interviewers about the next Who album. It would be about this deaf, dumb and blind boy. If you read over the interviews, you quickly realize that Townshend, though he had pretty well mapped out the story, only vaguely knew what it was about. But he knew enough to begin putting it together.

The album was produced, on the cheap (the sound quality is really poor), by The Who's manager, Kit Lambert. It was called Tommy. It was the break-out The Who needed and was looking for.

Unfortunately, Tommy presented a problem. How do you follow up the world's first "rock opera"? Townshend was at a loss. Live At Leeds, one of the greatest live albums ever, was released to stall for time.

Pete began to come up with the idea of a time in the future where music is either banned or forgotten. A lone hero rediscovers music, and a group of people gather in one place. Songs are created based on each individual. Everyone would have his/her own song. This is the really rough idea behind "The Lifehouse Project". (I've mangled and oversimplified the story.) It wasn't just going to be a concept album, it would be a concept event. The Who would perform a series of concerts in one place, with the same audience at every performance. Each individual at the concert, as in "The Lifehouse Project" would have his own song written, based on numerical biographical information (The sythesizer used on "Baba O'Riley" is based on the Maher Baba, Pete's spiritual guru, using such info.). The Who even attempted "Lifehouse" at The Old Vic. It was a dismal failure.

But songs had been written for "Lifehouse", and an album was needed. So the best tracks were put together to create, what I feel, is The Who's best album, Who's Next. Maybe the tracks don't work for you, Blitz, but for me, there ain't a bad song on this baby. From "Baba O'Riley" ("Teenage Wasteland" to the uneducated) to the epic "Won't Get Fooled Again", this is the tightest, hardest rockin', hardest hittin' Who album of all.

You say you hate the synths on Who's Next? You should get Dave Marsh's book, ...Before I Get Old.... His description, and defense of this album is far better than any I could mount. Particularly compelling his description of "Won't Get Fooled Again". He describes it as a battle between man and machine. The synthesizers, the machine (duh!) and the great Keith Moon using his drums to beat the muthas back. Rogers catharthic scream is the tie breaker.

Of the bonus cuts, |sighs|. Silence is about the only thing that can probably follow "Fooled Again". "Pure and Easy", a nice song, originally a part of "The Lifehouse Project" (as was "Naked Eye", I believe), just sounds so incongruous follow the "Won't Get Fooled Again" battle. Generally, I'd prefer to find the bonus cuts on a Who's Missing type of disc. For me, Who's Next is one of those rare perfect albums. The bonus cuts only tamper with the perfection.

Oh, and just for the record, I used to have all The Who's album. Currently I have The Who Sing "My Generation", A Quick One, Tommy, Live At Leeds, Who's Next, Meaty, Beaty, Big and Bouncy, Quadrophenia, Who Are You, Who's Last, Join Together, Maximum R&B-30 Years of The Who, The BCC Sessions, and Blues to The Bush. I do plan on getting all the rest though.

(Now do you see why I had to rest before posting this monstrosity?)

*stares in awe*
...Good lord. You think Pete had touble following Tommy? How and I suppose to top THAT? Well, I'll try...

First off, I should point out that I never said that I "hate" synths, just that I'm not a big fan of them because most people don't use them very well. Most song with synths ethier sound like a low budget Sci-fi film, or are almost identical to other instruments (what's the point in that?). However, "Baba O'Riley" and "Won't Get Fooled Again" are just about perfect!

Now, on to more general arguments. I agree that some of The Who's best moments are on Who's Next, but are they all? I don't think so..."Getting In Tune" and "The Song Is Over"? Nope; I don't think so. They're just to...dull. Also, while the "man versus machine" idea is interesting; I think you already know that I think music should be judged on soully musical terms. The symbollism is a nice thought, but I don't think it has anything to do with the actual song (not that it hurts it, of course).

On to the bonus tracks. I agree with your comment that nothing, much less "Pure and Easy", can follow "Won't Get Fooled Again" and work. Closeing with the other "Behind Blue Eyes" is, as I said before, is a bad call too. On the other hand, I think it would have been a mistake to leave "Pure and Easy" out. Aside from the fact that it's a nice song, but it's kind of s.tupid for "The Song Is Over" to quote it if it's not on the album. If you ask me, they should have intigrated "Pure and Easy", "Baby, Don't You Do It", "Naked Eye", and "Water" into the album it's self insted of simple slapping them on the end. I think a line up something like this would have been perfect:

Baba O'Riley
Bargain
Love Ain't For Keeping
My Wife
Baby, Don't You Do It
The Song Is Over
Getting In Tune
Naked Eye
Water
Going Mobile
Pure And Easy
Behind Blue Eyes
Won't Get Fooled Again

Of coure, then die hard fans would be up in arms for dareing to tamper with the "perfect" line up. I guess it has to do with the fact that I wasn't around when they first came out, but I just can't fathom that kind of reverence for an album. I mean, it's only Rock and Roll (to quote the song). Now, I do like it (quoting it again), but I don't see how any album can be "perfect". As long as there's people involved in makeing it, there'll be at least some problems...but now I'm preaching...

Hmm. I'll have to program that line up, the next time I play Who's Next. I'll let you know what I think. There's a couple of Monkees' discs that list the original sequences of those albums, and I've played them that way. The Beatles' Sgt. Pepper's lists an alternate tracking, too. It's fun to hear songs in a different light.

I wouldn't have any problems with them integrating the bonus cuts into the body of Who's Next. I'd've prefered it, seeing how determined they were to put 'em on there. I mean, c'mon, if they can do it to Live At Leeds and Odds and Sods, they can do it for Who's Next and The Who Sell Out.

Uh, to be honest, I really do like "The Song Is Over" (you've got it stuck in my weary little brain. Thanks.) and "Goin' Mobile". Oh well, who said I've got taste. (And if they said I did... well who you gonna believe.)

Hey, I like "Goin' Mobile" too, I just wish it was electric (and had a real guitar solo instead of that synth). Also, as I said, I wish that they had integrated the bonus tracks into the regular line up. Not so much to assist the flow alone, but to force the compilers to only use good songs. I mean, the only reason that other "Behind Blue Eyes" was included was for historical value. It's just not good listening. I suppose the reason the didn't actually re-do Who's Next was that reverance I was ranting about. I don't know if it was a factor in Sell Out, but I don't think it matters there. I can't think of a better line up than the one actually on the CD. The origional tracks are just too light for the most part to have the heavier bonuses peppered throughout without totally destroying any sense of cohesion.

It appears that in about two weeks, Who's Next is being reissued - again. I haven't been able to learn any details about the nature of the reissue, or why they're bothering to do so. It was within the last 6 years that it was digitally remastered with bonus tracks added. Unless MCA plans to bring it closer to the "Lifehouse Project" version, I just don't see the point of a reissue.

Live At Leeds on the other hand... When it's re-released (Sept. 18th), it will as a double disc set. Here's the tracks list:
CD1:
1. "Heaven & Hell"
2. "I Can't Explain"
3. "Fortune Teller"
4. "Tattoo"
5. "Young Man Blues"
6. "Substitute"
7. "Happy Jack"
8. "I'm A Boy"
9. "A Quick One"
10. "Summertime Blues"
11. "Shakin' All Over"
12. "My Generation"
13. "Magic Bus"
CD2:
1. "Overture"
2. "It's A Boy"
3. "1921"
4. "Amazing Journey"
5. "Sparks"
6. "Eyesight To The Blind (The Hawker)"
7. "Christmas"
8. "The Acid Queen"
9. "Pinball Wizard"
10. "Do You Think It's Alright?"
11. "Fiddle About"
12. "Tommy Can You Hear Me?"
13. "There's A Doctor"
14. "Go To The Mirror"
15. "Smash The Mirror"
16. "Miracle Cure"
17. "Sally Simpson"
18. "I'm Free"
19. "Tommy's Holiday Camp"
20. "We're Not Gonna Take It".

Yup. The entire Tommy album live (except "Welcome"). The re-release is in commeration of the 30th anniversary of Live At
Leeds. Personally, I'm kinda looking forward to it.

Now how about a new album from The Who?

Stunningly, it appears that the death of John Entwistle will not force the band's tour to be canceled. Replacing the Ox on bass will be someone named Pino Palladino. Uh, who? (No pun intended.) I'm sorry, but this is about as bad as Micky Dolenz and Davy carry on as "The Stars of the Monkees". Yeesh. Pete, Roger. Let it go. Y'all went through three drummers (and almost 20 years) before you found a decent one (Zak Starsky) to replace Keith Moon. Y'all don't have that long to properly replace John.

(So long, John. You'll be sorely missed.)

From what I understand, Palladino is not a permanent replacement; he's merely been hired for the current tour. I also understand from people who have seen them playing that he seems to be doing okay, and they have mentioned that the surviving band members felt that John wouldn't have wanted them to cancel the tour on his account.

God, I feel sick: http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe/01/13/uk.townshend/index.html

I'd love to believe Townshend is truly innocent, but right now I have a desire to do to my Who CD collection what Towser has done to guitars over the years. DAMMIT! Dammitdammit.

UPDATE: following his arrest yesterday, Townshend has been released on bail and is due to reattend later in the month.

Another update: Townshend was arrested because of an investigation that centered on a Ft. Worth, Texas based Internet company that ran a multi-million dollar child pornography service. The investigation, Operation Avalance, was begun in 1999.

I don't know about anyone else, but I don't think I'll ever be able to listen to the song, "The Kids Are Alright" again. This has really tainted this and a few other Who songs for me.

Benn ... accept the music for what it IS, entertainment! Whenever you place social/economic/etc. values upon the music you are hearing ... ? Do you equate musical enjoyment to social justice?

I believe he's innocent and telling the truth for the following reason. Last year, up at a website (his, i think) he wrote an essay or a letter or something about the ease of finding child porn. I beleive he said you could type 'russian orphanages' and come up with pedophilia sites on many search engines. The details are somewhat skecthy in my mind at the moment but they did talk about it on The View this morning.

Again, I want to believe him. But, come on. He said he went to the kiddie porn site to "see what was there"? Uh, Pete - naked children, that's what! I've never gone to such a site, but I know that's what'll be there. That sounds like such a weak explanation.

Some pedophiles are in denial regarding their sickness. In everything I've read, Townshend sounds like he's in denial. Many pedophiles do not believe they are harming children. Some actually believe they are helping the children.

Plus there's Townshend's statement that he thinks he may have been sexually abused himself. Many people who are abused in turn abuse children. It becomes a vicious cycle.

I'm aware that Towser has purportedly condemned child pornography on his website (www.eelpie.com). It could be a cover. It could be sincere. I don't know.

Once more, I sincerely hope that Pete Townshend's motivations were innocent, if hopelessly misguided. But in this day and age where people succumb their baser instincts, I doubt it.

I've been a fan of the Who for a long time. I think Pete Townshend's an excellent songwriter. There are so many songs I love: "Slit Skirt", "Eminence Front", "5:15", "Baba O'Reilly", "The Seeker", "Rough Boys", etc. I'm sure I'll listen to the songs again, but right now...

Right now, I feel like I'm potentially....

Okay, I suppose to a large degree I feel betrayed. It's hard for me to accept that someone whose work I've admired and enjoyed; who I've helped support financially by buying their albums and attending their live performances, may be a pedophile. I suppose my feelings are unreasonable.

But it's not just a feeling of betrayal. There's a sense of moral outrage, too. Child pornography is, needless to say, WRONG. And if, if, Pete Townshend is indeed guilty of this crime...

Right now, listening to a Who album or a Pete Townshend solo album just wouldn't feel right. Maybe in a month or two or if Towser is vindicated, maybe. But for now, I think I'd get a bit queasy hearing those songs.

np - Diary of a Madman - Ozzy $#@!!* Osbourne

I see that Pete Townshend has been cleared of charges of possessing child pornography. However, he has been placed in a national register of sex offenders.

"It's all one song." - Neil Young

>np - Diary of a Madman - Ozzy $#@!!* Osbourne

Not the new bastardized version, I hope, Benn.

It's the reissue version of the CD that I have. In what way is it bastardized? Or is it?

"It's all one song." - Neil Young

Benn, see the board "Ozzy sued by former bandmates" that I first posted on 8/21/02 in the catch basin. Also read the uniformly negative reviews on amazon.com.

P.S. Benn, if your disc has the bonus live track of "I Don't Know", then you've got the bogus version.

Oh yeah! I remember that discussion, Todd. I think you and I were the only to post on it. Maybe somebody else did, too. I'm not sure.

But no, my copy doesn't have "I Don't Know (live)" on it, so I've got the good version, I guess you could say.

np - Flashback - Electric Light Orchestra

"It's all one song." - Neil Young

Another way to tell if you've got a "good" version is if your CD cover has a small version of the album cover with a green border and the word Ozzy in yellow lettering down the side (this version is no longer manufactured and is sure to become a major collectors item soon). And of course there's the most obvious way, if Daisley and Kerslake are credited.

They're credited - as songwriters. However, Rudy Sarzo and Tommy Aldridge handle the bass and drums, respectively. Beyond that, it sounds like I've got the good, legit, kosher (pick an adjective) version.

Well, this certainly has a lot to do with the Who, doesn't it?

np - Enchanted - Stevie Nicks

"It's all one song." - Neil Young

Well, guess what? There's a new Who compilation out - Then and Now. It's been released in conjunction with the 'Oo's 40^th Anniversary. The disc contains the usual suspects: "I Can't Explain", "My Generation", "The Kids Are Alright", "Substitute", "I'm a Boy", "Happy Jack", "I Can See For Miles", "Magic Bus", "Pinball Wizard", "See Me, Feel Me", "Summertime Blues (live)", "Behind Blue Eyes", "Won't Get Fooled Again", "5:15", "Love, Reign O'er Me", "Squeeze Box", "Who Are You" and "You Better You Bet". So, why should any self-respecting Who fan want this disc? Well, it does have the first two new Who songs since 1989 ("Dig" and "Fire"). (Unless you count "Saturday Night's Alright [For Fighting]" from '91. But the latter two tracks were cover tunes.) The songs are "Real Good Looking Boy" (which features Greg Lake on bass) and "Old Red Wine (For John)" (with Pino Palladino on bass). "Real Good Looking Boy", a Roger Daltrey and Pete Townshend duet (essentially), is the better of the two songs.

Incidentally, it seems that "the Who" (Roger and Towser) are planning a new album. a new Who album Suggested titles: Who's Left or Who's Still Here.

np - Candy-O - the Cars

"Music is a world within itself and a language we all understand."

>So, why should any self-respecting Who fan want >this disc?

Actually, by my reckoning, the ideal Who compilation has yet to be released.

Yeah, I agree. All of the Who compilations have been lacking. (Most compilations are, anyway. Doesn't matter which artist you're talking about. Well. Okay. A Partridge Family compilation would be complete with just two songs. A Brady Bunch one with one cut. But other than that...) Still, if you have all of the other Who albums, or plan to get them, I'm just pointing out a reason to get Then and Now.

Just for the record, the best Who compilation, IMNSHO, is Meaty, Beaty, Big and Bouncy. Yeah, it's hopelessly incomplete, but it's put together in such a way that it doesn't sound like a collection of singles. It sounds - and feels - like a real album. If that makes any sense.

np - A&M Classics Volume 21, Joan Armatrading - Joan Armatrading

"Music is a world within itself and a language we all understand."

So the Who are planning a new album huh? Here are a couple of suggestions guys....

Who's Flogging A Dead Horse
Who's Got No Sense Of Decency
Who's In Desperate Need Of Money

Anymore suggestions? Man, nothing worse than seeing a band trying to rescusitate a pointless career. We have our memories, thanks, we don't need to be insulted anymore.

I have no problem with Towser or Daltrey touring, but to tour as The Who is really demeaning to Moon and Entwhistle.

I feel the same way about less talented bands like The Doors or CCR doing the same thing.

But then again, I've just shelled out $90 to see Kiss for the 6th time...am I being a hypocrite now? My only comment is that they have been constantly around whereas the ones mentioned above haven't.

Okay, relax folks. This isn't a sign that the world's about to end, but---- I agree with Rodney! I know, it's hard to believe, but it's true!

With John Entwistle's death, Roger and Pete should have called it a day. If they really felt a need to continue recording together, they should at least not use the Who name. Might I recommend "The Detours" or "High Numbers"?

Please keep in mind, I like the new cuts on Then and Now, but they're not really Who songs. I mean, come on Greg Lake on bass?! What is this, RLP? (Roger, Lake and Peter?) At best, the Who should have began recording again in '90, just after the first reunion tour. As it, it's just pure greed on Daltrey's and Townshend's part.

One caveat: I may, when it comes out, buy the next album. I don't think I'll see the concert, though. I can already guarantee that the price for seeing "the Who" will be too much. And that's because it won't the real Who. Hey, Pete! Ask yourself this: "Can you see the real me?" I don't think you'll like the answer.

np - Cookin' With the Miles Davis Quintet - Miles Davis (Happy birthday, Miles! You are missed!)

"Music is a world within itself and a language we all understand."

Question for the Music God Benn-

Do the pictures in the booklet for Quadrophenia mean anything or are they open for interpretation?? (If so, I would be keen to hear what you and other posters think they mean)

They basically correspond to many of the songs of Quadrophenia. There's "Jimmy" (the hero of Quad) on a train ("5:15). A bell boy. Etc. They also seem to be following Jimmy throughout a day in his life. At least that's as far as I know. I'll look around to see if I can't find a more detailed analysis.

"Music is a world within itself and a language we all understand."

Hi there. Some of you out there may have noticed by now that I like to contribute to the Music boards, and that I like to list my favorite songs by my favorite artists. And if my favorite artists are not already topics on the "Misc. Artists/Bands" thread, I will create them!

And now, here I am on "The Who" board. And I have read some your posts discussing the individual band member's trials and tribulations, their exploits, their conquests, and so on and so forth. I am not here to didscuss anything like that. I don't really care that much about Roger, Pete, the late Keith, and the late John on an individual basis. I just like the music of the group as a whole. After all, this group is one of my favorite British Rock Groups, as evidenced when I wrote my post one of the other music-related boards last year.

So, here are my favorite Who songs:

"My Generation"
"Boris The Spider"
"I Can See For Miles"
"Magic Bus"
"Pinball Wizard"
"The Seeker" (And as I just wrote on the Rush board, they covered that song on their "Feedback" EP)
"Summertime Blues" (live)
"Baba O'Reilly"
"Bargain"
"Behind Blue Eyes"
"Won't Get Fooled Again"
"Join Together"
"Long Live Rock"
"Squeeze Box"
"Who Are You"
"You Better You Bet"
"Another Tricky Day"
"Eminence Front"

Well, there they are, all 18 of them. You see, I don't feel the need to acquire every single album they ever put out. And according to some of the posts on this thread, that doesn't sound like a good idea!

Anyway, thank you for letting me have my say. Bye for now.

Just an update to my above post. Remove "Summertime Blues (live) and replace it with "Athena", a song I had totally forgotten about until I downloaded it and put it on my iPod. Rush has done the best cover of SB, IMO.

I can't think of any others right now. And to me, this band failed to still exist after 1982's "It's Hard". Even though Keith Moon had already been dead for four years!

Yeah, but Pete Townshend did some really good solo work afterward. I specifically refer you to 1985's "White City-A Novel". Too bad the album's kinda short, at about 38 and a half minutes.

All the Best Cowboys Have Chinese Eyes is a good one, too. I agree with you, Adam, about White City. It's a very strong album.

If Pete Townshend had been found guilty, would The Who now be portrayed as a trio - Daltrey, Entwhistle and Moon - who performed songs that magically appeared out of nowhere?