I like DOS! Let the computer holy wars begin.
NO! I will not allow it! The Macintosh must proliferate at any cost! Loyal Mac users, stand with us! K's'tl'k, prepare your LegBite! Lieutenant Commander Naraht, make ready the hydrofluoric acid! Master of the ;At, use your space-time relocation powers! Jerry Seinfeld, write some stupid jokes about it! Scott Adams, do some incisive workplace satire on the subject! Oh esteemed Chief of the Nitpicker's Guild, prepare the Nitpicker's Guide to Windows 98!
They invaded our space, and we fell back. They assimilated our entire government and we fell back! Not anymore! The line must be drawn here! This far and no further! We will make them for what they've done!
The Mac is dead! Long Live the Mac!
AAAAHHHHHH! I thought we got rid of you a long time ago, Digsy!
Sorry, you're all wrong! Unix will rule forever!
(doing a Whoopi Goldberg imitation) Unix? Excuse me, I thought you said
*Unix*? I mean, couldn't *possibly* be Unix...
Oh, I'm sorry, I'd better slow dooowwwnnn. Yooouuu'rreee mmmaaacchhinnnnnee
ppprrrroooobbbaaabbblllyyy cccaaannnn't uuuunnnnddddeeerrr sstttaaannnd
mmmmeee.
lineat
Linux rules ! Follow the penguin ! Available both for iPC and Mac !
(But the really tough guys use still CP/M.)
DOS will always be the best OS! Most of you simpletons probably don't even know how to do a unrecoverable format in DOS!
Real Programmers don't use an OS. They program the bare metal!
Real Amish don't use Operating Systems.
Mac OS Seven should be renamed MOSS, because thats all the boxes are going to collect on the store shelves!
Hello? Are you living in the modern world? Mac OS is up to version 8.5.1 now, you ignorant 80s DOS-loving induhvidual!
If I used Mac OS 8, then it would be 'MOSE' and that doesn't mean anything, now does it? DOES IT?!? HUH?!?!!? And its not like us REAL PC users actual care or need to know about this information!
iMac s*cks! Get a REAL computer!
Hello? Does it reside in this space-time continuum? Can you hear the processor fan going? Can you see the wonderful bondi blue exterior? Can you smell the wonderful odor of plastic? Can you lovingly stroke the polycarbonate outer casing? It's as real as you and me!
WARNING - SOME PEOPLE MAY BE OFFENDED BY THIS!!!
The hardest part about being a Unix Guru is wearing that darn turban and loincloth.
Hey DOS man, you just sit there and enjoy yourself. I'll get some actual WORK done, while you reprogram the source code every time you want to print a bloody DOCUMENT. Have fun.
Ja?
Now, now, now. I'm sure we can have a calm, [Ahem] rational discussion of which is better, PCs or Macs. Why are PCs better than Macs? Why are Macs as good as PCs? What about the other systems which will be lumped into the category of PCs? Why are they good? Don't just say they just are......Mac scum
Windowstm is not logical. Mactm is not logical. It is logical that one should use a variant of Unix.
I will tell you why Macs are as good as or better than PCs. For one thing, the PowerPC G3 processor is more efficient than the Pentium 2 or 3. This means that a 400 mhz G3 is approximately as fast as (or a little slower than, but not much) a Pentium 3/500. Second, there is the system software. According to one report, there will be an update to Windows 98 released that fixes some 600 bugs. This means that the product must have shipped with at least 600 bugs. If any other software developer released any other program with this many problems, they would probably have to issue a recall. But since it is Windows, and 90.4% of the computer world is forced to use it, the people just grin and bear it. Mac system softare is infinitely more reliable, and Macs themselves crash only about 5% as much as their PC counterparts. Even the editors of magzines sich as PC Computing will admit to this. Third, there is the appearance factor. The Mac interface, beginning with OS 8.5, is fully customizable and can be made to look like a variety of things. Someday I will post various screenshots of my system here so you can see what I am talking about. Meanwhile, every Windows PC looks the same except for the desktop picture. And last, but not least, is the outward appearance. Beginning with the iMac, Apple has gotten the idea that form need not be sacrificed to provide more functions. As a result, the iMac is one of the best-looking, most powerful, and cheapest family computers ever. The new blue and white G3s may look like a cheap knockoff of the iMc design, but they are some of the fastest, most innovative, and most expandable computers in existance, period. For all these reasons and more, I will support Apple well into the next millennium because I think they have a winning product strategy and someday, the world will realize it.
And Joel, it seems that you are doing exactly what you accuse other people of doing when you say "Mac scum" in your post-- namely, saying that they "just are." If you want others to follow specific guidelines, you should be willing to follow them yourself.
This first point is for Vulcan Unixite: Vulcan, if that IS your real name, why is Unix logical while Windows and the Mac are illogical? Explain your logic! This next point is for Matthew Patterson: You make some interesting points, which I will now proceed to embarrass you by systematically shooting down. Point 1: "...a 400 mhz G3 is approximately as fast as (or a little slower than, but not much) a Pentium 3/500." Maybe but, then again, a 400 mhz G3 costs $2,519, (Source: Apple Store)whereas a similarly configured Pentium III costs $1,760. (Source: ION Computers) So just imagine what you could get for the price of a 400 mhz G3. Point 2: "According to one report, there will be an update to Windows 98 released that fixes some 600 bugs. This means that the product must have shipped with at least 600 bugs." First, what report was that? I'd like to read it myself. Second, I would like to point out that windows people with all sorts of computers. MacOS on the other hand, is a propreitory operating system which is only used on computers sold by Apple. Even if that report was true, most (If not all.) of the bugs were probably very specific and affectiong only one or two people. And when you consider the millions of people that use Windows, I think those figures are pretty good. Point 3: "...But since it is Windows, and 90.4% of the computer world is forced to use it..." Excuse me? At least with PC you have some choice of OS. You hear people arguing about which OS on the PC is better and whether PCs or Macs are better. But, you don't hear people arguing about which OS on the Mac is better. And the reason for that is because there isn't any choice of OS! Anyone using a Mac is forced to use MacOS. So don't talk to ME about being forced to use an OS. And just where does that 90.4% figure come from, anyway? Point 4: "...Macs themselves crash only about 5% as much as their PC counterparts. Even the editors of magzines sich [sic] as PC Computing will admit to this." I find that very difficult to believe. Which issue did that come from anyway? I'd like to read it myself. And where did you hear that Macs only crash 5% as much as PCs? Point 5: "The Mac interface, beginning with OS 8.5, is fully customizable and can be made to look like a variety of things." How customizable? What things? Point 6: "...every Windows PC looks the same except for the desktop picture." That's not true. You can also adjust the color of everything from text to the borders on windows. Not to mention the fact that Windows comes with nearly 30 different pre-set color schemes which make it much easier to customize your interface. And, with the aid of accessories available from Microsoft's website, (Microsoft's website was having technical problems at the time of the writing of this message so I am unable to provide you with source.) you can also change the icons for various items. And last and most certainly least, Point 7: "...Apple has gotten the idea that form need not be sacrificed to provide more functions...the iMac is one of the
best-looking...family computers ever." Who cares? I know I for one care more about what my computer can do than how it looks. Who cares if your computer's case looks good if what's inside's junk? One last thing. That "Mac Scum" thing, was a joke. Whew, long post. I really got on a roll. It took me over an hour to write that.
Fine. Look here:
Point 1: "...a 400 mhz G3 is approximately as fast as (or a little slower than, but not much) a Pentium 3/500." Maybe but, then again, a 400 mhz G3 costs $2,519, (Source: Apple Store) whereas a similarly configured Pentium III costs $1,760. (Source: ION Computers) So just imagine what you could get for the price of a 400 mhz G3.
True. however, the extra cost can be explained.Currently, Apple is attempting to phase in several new technologies, such as USB (universal Serial Bus, which basically means that every device has the same connectors, just different driver software), and FireWire (or IEE 1394), which is a new, high-performance type of connection with transfer raqtes of up to 400Mbps. (4 times faster than 100BaseT Ethernet.) This makes it good for video editing, making, broadcasting, etc. So the extra cost can be explained, at least in part, by those infant technologies. Not to mention the performance increase over the older G3s and the new design, which makes it the computer with the most accessible guts in existence. And was that $1,760 figure with or without a monitor? And by "similarly configured," do you mean 400 mhz or 500 mhz? Because if it's 400, the G3 will smoke it.
"According to one report, there will be an update to Windows 98 released that fixes some 600 bugs. This means that the product must have shipped with at least 600 bugs." First, what report was that? I'd like to read it myself. Second, I would like to point out that windows people with all sorts of computers. MacOS on the other hand, is a propreitory operating system which is only used on computers sold by Apple. Even if that report was true, most (If not all.) of the bugs were probably very specific and affectiong only one or two people. And when you consider the millions of people that use Windows, I think those figures are pretty good.
Unfortunately, I saaw the report during one of my many "insomnia Net surfs," so I can't tell you where it's from. And, uh, "I would like to point out that Windows people with all sorts of computers." They do what, now? That is a sentence fragment! And how do you know that the bugs probably only affected 1 or 2 people each? Have you talked with al of the people in the world that use Windows? I happen to know one person who says that I Hate This Piece Of Trash 98 is the worst OS he has ever used and it took him days just to get it going! I'm not sure if you really know what you're saying here. (And really, I don't either. I haven't talked with enough people, and I don't know enough about Windows to nitpick it.)
...But since it is Windows, and 90.4% of the computer world is forced to use it..." Excuse me? At least with PC you have some choice of OS. You hear people arguing about which OS on the PC is better and whether PCs or Macs are better. But, you don't hear people arguing about which OS on the Mac is better. And the reason for that is because there isn't any choice of OS! Anyone using a Mac is forced to use MacOS. So don't talk to ME about being forced to use an OS. And just where does that 90.4% figure come from, anyway?
No, don't talk to ME about being forced to use an OS. Mac users DO have a choice. It just happes to be that not many Mac users really know what they're doing with respect to Linuxs, and so have not yet decided to take the plunge. And just who argues which OS on the PC is better? I have never heard anything like this. And just where does that 90.4% figure come from, anyway? Wow. That was the one tinkg I thought you wouldn't argue with. Think the figure is too low? In answer to your question, it's pretrty much the consensus among the Mac and PC world that that's the figure. Can't really know or sure, but oh well. And tell me, how many PC users REALLY use an OS other than Windows? I bet it's something on the order of the number of people that use Macs.
"...Macs themselves crash only about 5% as much as their PC counterparts. Even the editors of magzines sich [sic] as PC Computing will admit to this." I find that very difficult to believe. Which issue did that come from anyway? I'd like to read it myself. And where did you hear that Macs only crash 5% as much as PCs?
Well, they don't exactly admit to it. They do complain repeatedly about their PCs going buggy, crashing, etc. And for the 5% remark, it's personal experience! My school uses all PCs. I have strange problems with them about 4/5 of the times I use them. But I have yet to have a problem serious enough to make me restart my iMac. And this is not due to inexperience. Usaually I'm just on the Net or typing along in Word! So please, don't try to tell me that Windows NT is stable. I know the truth.
"...every Windows PC looks the same except for the desktop picture." That's not true. You can also adjust the color of everything from text to the borders on windows. Not to mention the fact that Windows comes with nearly 30 different pre-set color schemes which make it much easier to customize your interface. And, with the aid of accessories available from Microsoft's website, (Microsoft's website was having technical problems at the time of the writing of this message so I am unable to provide you with source.) you can also change the icons for various items.
Oh, whoopee. You can change the color scheme. You can change the icons (with the help of a program from Microsoft.) Guess what? You have always been able to do this on Macs. Icon changing is BUILT-IN to the OS! And with the help of a little shareware program called "Kaleidoscope," you can make your Mac llok like all kinds of wild asnd crazy thigs. I will either post some screenshots of my Mac here or post a link to some to show you what I mean. But trust me, when you see them, you'll agree with me that every Windows PC looks basically alike.i{(Microsoft's website was having technical problems at the time of the writing of this
message so I am unable to provide you with source.)} Hee hee. No less than I would expect. I've never had trouble with Apple's site.
"...Apple has gotten the idea that form need not be sacrificed to provide more functions...the iMac is one of the best-looking...family computers ever." Who cares? I know I for one care more about what my computer can do than how it looks. Who cares if your computer's case looks good if what's inside's junk?
You wanna know who cares? Normal people who don't really care what their computer can do as long as it does it. Regular people who are new to the computer thing and want something non-intimidating. Gullible fools with deep pockets. PC users who are sick of the beige box. The point is, some people do care about the appearance and for your informatio, my iMac's insides are not "junk," thank you very much! Unless you have a 380 mhz Pentium II, it's faster than your computer! (Then again, for all I know, you do have a 380 mhz P2, Or a 500 mhz P3. In that case, sorry.) I will thank you not to refer to Macs that way. Your attitude will not endear you to may people (including the Chief.)
Your turn!
I've read here sometimes that people have trouble with html-pages near to 200kB. Strange, I can load 600kB of html without any problems... Linux yeah!
I think the major drawback in Windows (and in Apple, if it's as configurable as claimed) is that there are too many options for the user. That is to say, instead of getting work done, we spend a slew of time setting things like the number of colors on our screen, what sounds go off at different times, and what shape pointers to use.
Granted, Machines should be made to adapt to humans, not the other way around, but come on. Humans are adaptable - we live in differnt climates, if we lose a limb, we adjust. We can easily work with a computer regardless of whether the application border is blue or the taskbar is on the side or the bottom of the screen.
If we had a nice, simple OS which didn't spend so many resources doing trivial things, we might all get more done.
We do. It's called DOS. No one uses DOS anymore. Ancient operating systems and hokey fruits are no match for the power of Bill Gates at your side.
Humans are adaptable, but we like doing trival things. If you need an example, look at 90% of the web pages on the internet.
Including this one
What about litestep, the variant to Win 95? It washes all your dated OS's to the trash bin!!!
Whatstep?
Chewwie: You don't have to configure those things to use Windows. Nor do you have to micromanage every single detail. That's what schemes are for.
Matthew Patterson: I think it's about time I got around to responding to your post. "Currently, Apple is attempting to phase in several new technologies, such as USB (universal Serial Bus, which basically means that every device has the same connectors, just different driver software)" USB has been around on PCs for a while. A pair of USB ports is a standard feature on all new ATX motherboards. (Source: PCGamer, Vol. 6 No. 2 P. 229)"...FireWire (or IEE 1394), which is a new, high-performance type of
connection with transfer raqtes of up to 400Mbps. (4 times faster than 100BaseT Ethernet.) This makes it good for video editing, making, broadcasting, etc." That's nice if you want to run a TV station from your computer. But why should the normal user have to pay an extra $700+ for something they're likely never going to use? "Not to mention the performance increase over the older G3s and the new design, which makes it the computer with the most accessible guts in existence." Oh goody, it's improved! So now it's up to half as good as the PC? So it has "accessible guts"? Perhaps the Mac's only good point. But then again, it's only a good point when added onto other good points, which the Mac does not have."And was that $1,760 figure with or without a monitor? And by 'similarly configured,' do you mean 400 mhz or 500 mhz?" It was without out a monitor. But then again, so was the $2,519 figure. With a monitor, the G3 is $3,498. And that doesn't even include a modem. Also the PC was 500 mhz. "Unfortunately, I saaw the report during one of my many 'insomnia Net surfs,' so I
can't tell you where it's from." Well, if you can't tell me where it came from then how do I know it's real? You could've made it up or imagined it. "And, uh, 'I would like to point out that Windows people with all sorts of computers.' They do what, now? That is a sentence
fragment!" Thank you so VERY much for pointing that out to me. What I meant to say was "I would like to point out that Windows is used by people with all sorts of computers." "I happen to know one person who says that I Hate This Piece Of Trash 98 is the worst OS he has ever used and it took him days just to get it going!" Oh yes? Was he a former Mac user? "And just who argues which OS on the PC is better? I have never heard anything like this." Well maybe you should read some of the other messages on this board. "Well, they don't exactly admit to it. They do complain repeatedly about their PCs going buggy, crashing, etc." Give me three examples. "And for the 5% remark, it's personal experience! My school uses all PCs. I have strange problems with them about 4/5 of the times I use them. But I have yet to have a problem serious enough to make me restart my iMac." Maybe you're just biased so you don't notice the problems with the iMac. "So please, don't try to tell me that Windows NT is stable. I know the truth." I'm sorry, were we talking about Windows NT? I thought we were talking about Windows 9x. Okay, I think I'll argue the rest of that post a little later.
Eh. Took you awhile to respond. I've lost the evangelistic fever, so now I will attempt to respond rationally.
I happen to know one person who says that I Hate This Piece Of Trash 98 is the worst OS he has ever used and it took him days just to get it going!" Oh yes? Was he a former Mac user?
As a matter of fact, no. He is a diehard Wintel geek. And most of his problems stem from the fact that he is attempting to use it on a Pentium 90 computer. (Although I can't resist pointing out that the latest, greatest Mac OS will work just fine on a Mac from the same era. Provided you have enough RAM.)
And for the 5% remark, it's personal experience! My school uses all PCs. I have strange problems with them about 4/5 of the times I use them. But I have yet to have a problem serious enough to make me restart my iMac." Maybe you're just biased so you don't notice the problems with the iMac.
No. I am aware of the problems with the iMac. I wish for a 2-button mouse daily, and would get one if I had the $$$. And this was about five days after I got the thing. I have experienced an average of about one crash per week since then. None of these crashes were due to the iMac or its system itself. In fact, most all of them can be traced to Netscape. And I'd switch if IE weren't half as fast.
USB has been around on PCs for a while. A pair of USB ports is a standard feature on all new
ATX motherboards. (Source: PCGamer, Vol. 6 No. 2 P. 229)
So? This doesn't mean a thing! It wasn't until the advent of the iMac tha USB became a widely accepted standard because people weren't using USB devices. They had other options and so USB, despite being superior to old standards of serial and such, was basically ignored. The iMac changed this by offering USB as the only method of connecting peripherals, thus ensuring that USB devices would be developed. And this is precisely what has happened, and now most products come in USB as well as other versions. (Except for HP printers, until recently. I like Epson anyway.)
I think that there are problems with the Mac OS. I think there are more problems with Windows. (The fact that it's still based on DOS after so long doesn't help.) But I think the Mac OS offers the best way of interacting with your computer. (Although I do kinda like the Palm OS.) I might be interested in getting a PC solely for games, because that is really the only area that is lacking in the Macintosh. I will freely admit this. However, I prefer the Nintendo for games anyway. And the iBook and AirPort look about ready to revolutionize wireless Internet access. (If only the FCC would hurry up and grant clearance.)
Oh, in case anyone was following the Seybold Seminars today, Apple introduced the Power Mac G4 at the keynote. In case you'd like to learn more about this marvelous (except the case) machine, follow the hypertext road: http://apple.com/powermac. In other news, Apple's stock rose 3 3/16, to 65 1/4.
Question for anyone who knows:
All of the machines at my school are 3-4 years old and running Windows 95. What, if any, Y2K problems should we be expecting? I'm fairly certain that Win95 is NOT compliant, although I think the most recent versions of 98 are. (Can't resist pointing out that, as long as the power stays on, my Mac from the same era will be up and running with no problems.) But anyway, should we be expecting major glitches (other than the usual ones?)
Meanwhile, Apple's stock is somewhere around 77, up from the 20s at this time last year…
M$ has a Y2K patch for Win95. I forget the URL.
However, since they'll be off over the new year, they will probably be OK for the most part.
There are some patches but they don't work properly ! Good old M$...
My Commodore 128 has never crashed on me! Of course there's no Internet access, but I can do just about anything else I want to on it. Long live Commodore!
What kinda chip you got in there, a Dorito?
Howto get rid of paperclip !
Some people here don't like the cute paperclip assistant from M$ Office 97. Ha ha ha.
Use Regedit:
HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Office\8.0\Common\Assistant : Set "AsstState" to 0 (and repeat this every time after you've run the installation program).
CLIPPY MUST DIE!
Of course you can also rename the "Actors" directory to "Dead Actors"...
For those of you who think M$ hasn't done anything unfair in their business practices, I suggest you consult http://theadvocate.com and see what kind of headlines you find there. I never thought I'd say this, but the government is right!
Don't consult The Advocate. Instead, go to http://nytimes.com. Be advised, you may have to register. (Stup¡d Advocate. They put the Microsoft story on their front page, but can't be bothered to updae their site with it…)
Isn't it $tupid how a country who is billions of dollars in debt is trying to say Microsoft's (THE most successfull company of all time) practice's are wrong? Maybe the USA should take a lesson from Microsoft instead of allowing the witchhunt!
No, because then we'd have "Clippy the demon office supply from hell" telling us how to vote.
And if we voted in a manner the Republicans didn't like, we'd get a General Protection Fault
No. There is no problem with M$ having a monopoly. It is perfectly legal to have a monopoly in the US. However, once you have a monopoly, you must play by different rules. For example, you may not leverage your monopoly to gain a monopoly in a second market. In other words, you can't use the fact that every PC is shipped with Windows 95/95/NT to include Internet Explorer on them to gain a monopoly in the Browser market.
Oh, and for those who insist IE is an "integrated part of the Windows OS", I have exactly four words. Ready? Here they are: Internet Explorer For Macintosh.
Just because it is available for the Mac doesn't mean that it's somehow not an integrated part of the Windows OS. You're talking about two totally different things. The difference is, it doesn't cripple your Mac if you decide you want to remove IE from your hard drive.
I'm a Mac person, but I am disturbed by the whole thing. The last thing I want is some sort of government oversight board greenlighting decisions for the technology sector. Ugh. That would do wonders for the technology-driven economic boom, now, wouldn't it?
On the other hand, Matthew, IE is the only integrated component of Win98 that you can buy separately, for a completely different operating system. Unless you've found "Mac My Network Neighborhood" somewhere? It's weird that they claim it's part of the OS...but it's also a separate application. I think it means they had no intention of doing this integration foolishness until they got in trouble over their IE-related business practices.
Blecch. The whole thing leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
IIRC there is a program (98lite?) that can completely remove IE from any Win system and even install Win without IE.
Soo, is the board still broken on the "Last Day"?