I am so glad Lost is back this week! I guess it was originally going to be an even longer wait. Glad they changed their minds!

Interesting episode. I can't believe how big of a scumbag Locke's dad was, though I certainly saw it coming.

Good thing Charlie didn't find that plane with its cargo.

Speaking of Charlie, was he even in this ep? Ditto Claire. And Walt. Lots of people missing this week, and others barely there (Sun, Jin, Hurley).

Wow! Excellent episode! Locke's father is just one of those characters that will make me sneer everytime I see the actor on screen for a long time to come.

I was laughing my butt off during Jack's examination of Sawyer, you could tell that the questions were total bs, and that Jack knew what the problem was before the prostitute question. Hilarious!

By the way, Anonymous, you should pick a name for yourself. Someone may come along and usurp your position as official anonymous coward of the Lost board. ;)

Man, I'm glad this show is back. Just in time to interfere with final exam studying. Perfect.

How about that ending where the hatch lit up?

Was Sawyer reading A Wrinkle in Time last week? I don't recall seeing it, but Darth Sarcasm brought it up on that board, and now I saw that's what he was reading this week.

I'm willing to bet that the boy Locke was talking to in the Wal-Mart or whatever it was was Boone.

I think Kevin Tighe has almost always played an oily or corrupt character, so I kind of hoped he would be playing against type here. But why just dismiss Locke? It seemed they could have continued with a good relationship.

Now we know where all the money from those Nigerian e-mail scams is going!

I don't know if I'd be so anxious to open something that was sealed so well for a reason. After all, it could be nuclear waste or something. (I know, Locke has a vision, and there's a window in it.)

That container looks an awful lot like the air compresser module for my Sleep Number bed!

Influx: I'm willing to bet that the boy Locke was talking to in the Wal-Mart or whatever it was was Boone.

Dan Gunther: Wow, interesting thought... I would have never thought of that...

This was a wild episode. It was funny when Jack started his questions of Sawyer. Just total BS and mind games with sawyer that ya just had to laugh to see him get some back. And I loved how they got him his glasses at the end. Makes very good sense and I'm glad to see that the creators are taking into account the realism of having just so much stuff a person can salvage or use from an airplane. I'm just glad they didn't coincidentally find a pair of stylish cool glasses for sawyer as that would have totally blown things for me.

As for Locke and his dad. I guess his dad is that big of a selfish user that Locke didn't matter to him for anythign other than spare parts.

I thought it might be boone too in the store.

When I first saw the plane crashing in the vision, I thought and joked with my wife "Wow they'll finally find Amelia Earhart!" But seriously if somehtign like that does pop up on the show I will be very disappointed.

Boone got a mayday out and someone heard him!!!! Someone heard him. Now I know it wasn't long enough for a trace if whoever it was even could have done that but at least it would let the authorities know that someone was in trouble and start a search again. Unless it gets dismissed as a hoax, prank, or it was actually one of the mysterious "others" that everyone is afraid of.

And as for the nigerian's plane. What do you think will happen to it. Will the castaways scavenge it too? Jack might be able to do somethign with the heroin (At least use it as a painkiller) not to mention anythign else that might be useuful on it. Like the batteries that had enough charge left in them to use a radio.

It was rather blatent comedy for them to have Hurley just wander by to give his 1 liner and go away. Almost like there was a contractual obligation for him to appear. Although it was a funny 1 liner. Sorta.

And as for the giant pod of doom I don't know what is goign on with that but wow. Definately some spooky shtuff there witht he light at the end.

Like the batteries that had enough charge left in them to use a radio.

Yes, had. But I bet Boone didn't turn off the power before it crashed (I kept saying "Turn it off and wait for Sayed!!")}

And as for the giant pod of doom I don't know what is goign on with that but wow.

I vote we call it the gPod from now on...

Holy COW.

Um….was I the only one who had a problem with the casting of Kevin Tighe and Swoosie Kurtz as Locke’s would-be parents, or with how easily he accepted them as such?

Swoosie Kurtz: “I’m your mother, John!”
Kevin Tighe: “I’m your father, John!”
Locke: “Yeah, right. What, did you conceive me when you were both EIGHT YEARS OLD?!”

Locke tells Boone in Act 3 (I think) when he collapses that he was in a wheelchair for four years because he was paralyzed. Boone then asks why he was in a wheelchair. Locke says it doesn’t matter. Hello? He just told you. He was paralyzed. I got the sense from this that what Boone meant to say was “how were you paralyzed.”

How did Boone know that it was heroin in the Virgin statues, and not say, cocaine?

Gordon Lawyer: How about that ending where the hatch lit up?
Luigi Novi: Yeah, really. I’d die laughing if he opens it in the next episode, and it turns out to be the brief case from Pulp Fiction. (A Halliburton, brief case, of course…)

By the way, Anonymous, you should pick a name for yourself.

I would if I could come up with something I like. Until then, I'm stuck being a "coward" as you put it, though "lazy" is probably more like it.

Anyway, if you turned on the closed captions while Boone was on the radio, it turns out the party on the other end replied to him saying "there were no survivors of Oceanic 815". Take that however you like.

To me that says the outside world thinks the plane and all on board plunged into the ocean, but people could use this to try and argue the whole nutty purgatory scenerio. Or it could just be someone else on the island messing with them.

I couldn't make out what the guy on the radio said, but I read somewhere that he said that there were no survivors in the plane crash. Could anyone else make that out?

Luigi Novi: Um….was I the only one who had a problem with the casting of Kevin Tighe and Swoosie Kurtz as Locke’s would-be parents, or with how easily he accepted them as such?
Yeah, you know, I didn't realize it until Locke went to Cooper's house the first time, but it did seem odd.

Luigi Novi: Boone then asks why he was in a wheelchair. Locke says it doesn’t matter. Hello? He just told you. He was paralyzed. I got the sense from this that what Boone meant to say was “how were you paralyzed.”
I know he didn't ask "how", but I think Boone was just wondering what happened to cause the paralysis. And Locke picked up on that.

Maybe somebody who has a recording of the ep can clarify this: at the end, when Locke is banging on the hatch I believe he was bemoaning "why did you do this? I did everything you asked!" Apparently in reference to Boone's being seriously injured. But if the 'island' did give him instructions to follow it also told him what Boone's fate would be, in the form of that image in his dream. I would think that Locke would grasp that. Of course, I could be remembering his words incorrectly.

I believe the Mouse-Trap® description, while paralleling the Locke-kidney story, may also be a foreshadowing of the Island's "intent" (leading Locke to the "trap").

BTW, anyone seen "Dark City"?

There were a few very annoying moments in this ep. When it was revealed that the "plane" was just a dream of Locke's, it felt like a real cheat since ABC kept showing a plane in ads for the show. It was gratifying that it turned out to be real later.

I thought the show had gone too far, when Locke's mother announced that he was concieved through "immaculate conception" (I thought SW:The Phantom Menace made a mistake using that). For secularists, it was an unwanted allusion to Christian mythology. For believers, it might seem disrespectful. Perhaps, it wasn't so surprising that the drug smugglers were disguising themselves as priests ( though, in real life, a small plane of priests personally transporting religious statuettes would probably bring attention to themselves). The heroin in the Madonna figures recalled the famous quote (from Marx, I believe) that "religion is the opiate of the masses".

Locke looked ridiculous in that black toupee. Instead of making him look younger, it actually made him look older. He looked to be around the same age as his "father" and "mother". The plotline of his father using him just to get a kidney was very well done. It reflected the cynism of many today. It was also more believable that his mother was intentionally deceiving him, though many mentally ill people have religious delusions (if she was as delusional as she initially pretended to be, she would probably be dysfunctional in everyday life).

I didn't tape the show, but I seem to recall a few instances when Locke was using his paralysied leg. The ending seemed a bit heavy handed. It almost appeared that Locke was looking into a flying saucer, and they responded with illuminating the window.

Jack's questioning of Sawyer seemed to suggest that Sawyer might have syphillus ( the History Channel always describes individuals in previous centuries going blind and insane from syphillus). It certainly made for more family-friendly television that he was just far-sighted!

Mr Porter: I would think that Locke would grasp that.
Luigi Novi: He understood that Boone would be injured if he did the wrong thing, but figuring out what that right thing is is a different matter.

Influx: BTW, anyone seen "Dark City"?
Luigi Novi: I tune, Influx. Can you tune?

Rona: There were a few very annoying moments in this ep.
Luigi Novi: What a surprise.

Rona: I thought the show had gone too far, when Locke's mother announced that he was concieved through "immaculate conception" (I thought SW:The Phantom Menace made a mistake using that). For secularists, it was an unwanted allusion to Christian mythology. For believers, it might seem disrespectful.
Luigi Novi: Since the person making this claim was clearly made out to be a schizophrenic at first (and later part of a scam), it issue of whether this conception was actually immaculate was moot. I used to be a believer, and am now a secularist. I did not see any "unwanted allusion" (indeed it is silly to say that good fiction should stay away from mythology, since the earliest fiction WAS mythology), and would not have felt disrespected a few years ago when I was a believer. That's just me.

Luigi Novi: Since the person making this claim was clearly made out to be a schizophrenic at first (and later part of a scam), it issue of whether this conception was actually immaculate was moot. I used to be a believer, and am now a secularist. I did not see any "unwanted allusion" (indeed it is silly to say that good fiction should stay away from mythology, since the earliest fiction WAS mythology), and would not have felt disrespected a few years ago when I was a believer. That's just me.

Dan Gunther: I'd have to second Luigi's sentiments. As a Catholic-turned-secularist, I'd have to say that the allusions were not the least bit offensive or disrespectful to me, or any in my family, some of whom are still Catholics. Like Luigi, that's just me. However, I will say that if fiction and literature were to shy away from every single contentious or debated issue for fear of offending or disrespecting anyone, our fictious worlds would suffer as a result. How boring would literature and other forms of fiction be?

I understand there was a time constraint (production-wise), but let's think about this: Locke tels Boone that he was a paraplegic and that the island 'made him whole'. Now, it seems to me that Boone kinda took that too calmly, as if Locke'd told him he likes Happy Meals to this day (a little quirky, but nothing even remotely odd). I dunno, seems to me there should have been a little more reaction from Boone.

Actually, I have a follow-on gripe... why does it *seem* like everyone's forgetting or not worrying about the apparently paranormal events that happen on the island? It's like they're not even interested (I'd be almost obssessed, considering).

1 - They survive a fatal crash; this can be dismissed as 'good luck', however.
2 - Locke CAN WALK.
3 - All the survivors (the ones introduced)... ALL OF THEM, have some serious issues in their pasts.
4 - Locke saw the 'creature', who has not killed anybody else since; in fact, it's not even appeared (Boone's hallucination notwithstanding) since then.
5 - There's a guy on the island that can carry two adults off by himself (later shot by Charlie).
6 - Jack's dead father 'shows up' -- either from the coffin or from thin air (if the Australian authorities didn't allow the body on board).
7 - Polar bears appear whenever Walt reads about them.
8 - There are voices/whispers in the jungle.
9 - Hurley's numbers, including the fact that they appeared on whatever it is Locke and Boone found.

Should I go on?

There is quite a lot strange going on. As for why they arn't freaking out about it all well maybe no one has woken up yet. (See Dark City ref earlier)

As for the Immaculate conception thing. It sounded like something that a person who was mentally unstable and hated the boy's father would say. A form of denial in which since locke didn't have a father that left the midichlorians. I would have been more surprised if she hadn't said something like that.

As another former Catholic, I have to say that "Immaculate Conception is the wrong term for the phenomenon it was supposed to be describing.

The correct term for a child miraculously concieved without a physical father is "Virgin Birth." All Christians (Catholics, Protestants, Orthodox, and even denominations that these three do not consider to be "really" Christian like Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses) who believe in Matthew 1 and Luke 1 believe in the Virgin Birth of Jesus.

The term "Immaculate Conception" referes to the specifically Catholic doctrine that Mary was, from the time of her conception, free from all sin, including Original Sin.

Influx: BTW, anyone seen "Dark City"?
Luigi Novi: I tune, Influx. Can you tune?

(Slight derail) When I first heard that I heard "He can choon!" I had no idea what that meant, even being "intimately" familiar with Richard O'Brien's accent from The Rocky Horror Picture Show. BTW, I don't believe we have a topic yet for RHPS? I have something related to that that Trek fans might enjoy. I'll have to check.

Luigi Novi -- I used to be a believer, and am now a secularist. Ditto- Dan Gunther, Green Banana
Wow,may be a lot of us here!} Our paths seem to parallel... we reach, brothers.

R -- by the dialogue, apparently the father and mother made that "immaculate conception" thing up so Locke would believe it. Mom said he wouldn't believe it otherwise. Truth to tell, I didn't even know what "conception" meant until well into my adult years. But hey, they never explained that stuff in Mass.

Sicily1918 - Welcome! It could be that not everybody else knows or shares about all those events yet. Hurley didn't even know Scott's (or Steve's) name even after almost a month on The Island.

I miss Rose!

Green Banana and Dan Gunther are relatively new also (I think)... Welcome to the site!

( though, in real life, a small plane of priests personally transporting religious statuettes would probably bring attention to themselves).

Not necessarily, especially when you consider that it was likely several years, if not a decade or more, earlier that this plane crashed, back when air travel wasn't nearly so paranoia inducing. Also, it would depend on their departure point and planned destination.

Locke looked ridiculous in that black toupee. Instead of making him look younger, it actually made him look older.

Yes, I agree completely.

Jack's questioning of Sawyer seemed to suggest that Sawyer might have syphillus

Nah, Jack was just yankin his chain.

As another former Catholic, I have to say that "Immaculate Conception is the wrong term for the phenomenon it was supposed to be describing.

So now we know Locke's mother isn't Catholic!

I think that Dan's been around for a while.

Anon: So now we know Locke's mother isn't Catholic!

I wouldn't say that. I didn't know that that was an incorrect term for it.

Green Banana and Dan Gunther are relatively new also (I think)... Welcome to the site!

Dan Gunther: Well, I guess it depends on how relatively you use the term... I've been around off and on since DS9 was on the air... but thanks for the welcome!

I wouldn't say that. I didn't know that that was an incorrect term for it.

Are you Catholic? Not tryin to put you on the spot, just if you are it makes your argument stronger.

R's posts have been moved to their proper board, and a couple others relating to them were deleted.

Anonymous: Are you Catholic?
Yeah, I am.

OK thank you sorry I goofed.

Okay, Josh, that being the case, I guess it doesn't prove anything beyond her not knowing the term.

You win this round!

Back to the episode. I'll admit I didn't spot this myself (I learned of it on another board), but when his mom asks where the footballs are, he says regulation in aisle 8 and Nerf in aisle 15.

It's pretty clear that Locke likes his job at the toy store. So how did he end up as a cubicle wage slave for a box company?

Maybe he felt he couldn't keep up at the toy store without the use of his legs, and opted for a desk job?

Or whatever happend to him caused him to either not want to or be able to return to the other job.

Anybody think that the presence of lots of heroin on the island will pose a challenge to Charlie?

Yeah just a bit. Maybe they'll have a really big bonfire with it though. Or maybe try adn find the monster and feed it to him? Now that could be scary.

Oh wow... look at the pretty colors... I've got the munchies! Oh goody, humans -- just the right snack!

Regarding the heroin...


POSSIBLE SPOILER ALERT POSSIBLE SPOILER ALERT


In the recent Entertainment Weekly featuring the Lost's boys on the cover, one of the producers said that one of the big the reasons Charlie overcame his addiction was because there was nothing to tempt him to keep it going. He certainly seemed to be hinting that Charlie will be tempted sometime in the future.

Whoa! Big revelation here about this episode!

According to the 5.29.05. TV Guide, the response over the transmitter that Boone got sounded like "There were no survivors of Flight 815" in the promos for the episode, but "We're the survivors of Flight 815" in the actual episode. Co-creator Damon Lindelof says that the episode was correct! He also says that it's up to extrapolation as to whether or not his own words were being bounced back to him. Or was the transmission coming from somebody else claiming to be a survivor of Flight 815? Lindelof says that watching finale may allow to extrapolate certain facts from that info. Does this mean Boone was talking to the Others?

One problem I see here is that the closed captioning says, "There were no survivors of Flight 815." I know the closed captioning is sometimes incorrect, but usually this amounts to spelling errors. Why would the cc have a different line?

In addition, while the first one or two words is obscured by he sounds of Locke screaming and the plane beginning to fall (so that we can't tell if it's "There were" or "We're"), we can distinctly here the word "no" in the message, which would only have been used if the person Boone spoke to said, "There were no..." How does Lindelof explain this?

You guys who are ahead of me may know the relevance of Boone's transmission scene already, but the DVD subtitles definately say, 'We're survivors of Oceanic Flight 815.' In the audio, there's an emphasis on the 'We're.'

It's definately not Boone's words coming back as the voice says some other things that Boone didn't say.

Hey guys! I'm just catching up with LOST on dvd. GREAT show! It never stops surprising me.

Okay, what I don't get about this ep. is: why the hurry? Locke and Boone spent 2 weeks building the trebuchet, but when they find the plane, Boone has to climb in immediately. They can't go back to camp to tell everybody else about it? They can't go back and get some rope and tackle to lower it in a controlled way?

This seems unlike Locke, who always acted as patient, wise, mentor-like person before. Even if he's panicking about loosing his ability to walk, how does he know that "the Island" wants him to use force at all to open the gPod? Maybe the trebuchet failed because there's another way? Have they tried knocking in code? (Saying the magic word?) Maybe this isn't the entrance at all, maybe they need to dig out more, and the entrance is 20 yards to the right?

On the TWoP site, the reviewer complains about Jack having fun with Sawyer, and Hurley then joking about Sawyer's glasses. I don't agree, because they poke fun at Sawyer not because of the glasses, but because Sawyer goes out of his way to act like a jerk (and as the ep. Con Man showed, he wants to be treated badly as punishment for what he's done. Because it's easier to be a jerk and despise yourself, than try to change yourself when you realise you've made wrong choices.).

As for Jack being a bad doctor when he's afraid of Sawyer's snarking and doesn't want to have a look at him... a doctor can't treat a person who doesn't want to.

(I just had to get that of my chest...)

SPOILER:

Since we see in one of the later ep.s that the rest of the group now knows about the plane, does this mean that Sayid has taken the radio and other salvageable, important parts? Because when Sayid and Charlie come upon it (in Exodus 2), the heroin statues are still lying around, instead of either being given to Jack for medicinal purposes, or been safely destroyed.)

Locke's father, Anthony Cooper, shares a name with a real world counterpart, Lord Anthony Ashley-Cooper, who was the philosopher John Locke's political mentor and patron.