Star Trek II - The Wrath Of Khan Part 2

Nitcentral's Bulletin Brash Reflections: ClassicTrek: The Movies: Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan: Star Trek II - The Wrath Of Khan Part 2
By Adam Bomb on Tuesday, April 30, 2002 - 6:52 am:

TV Guide just released a 35th anniversary salute to all things "Star Trek." In this edition, there is a page devoted to the DVD releases of "Trek" It states that "Star Trek II - The Wrath Of Khan" will be reissued on a Special Edition DVD with four hours of bonus material.
That is good news, especially for those of us new to DVD. However, I purchased the "Original Cast" movie DVD six pack on the day of release. Now, as probably all the "Trek" films will be released on "Special Edition" DVD's at one time or another, this will render my collection obsolete. Comments?


By Brian Fitzgerald on Tuesday, April 30, 2002 - 8:30 am:

That is the problem with updated editions. If you're looking to sell your old DVDs you might try http://www.half.com. It's a site where you can list DVD's, CDs & VHS. You set the price you are willing to sell for and wait for someone to buy it. It was a great site for getting rid of lots of my old VHS tapes when I upgraded to DVD special editions and the like.


By Adam Bomb on Monday, May 06, 2002 - 10:25 am:

According to "Entertainment Weekly," "Men In Black" is on its third DVD version. Overkill, anyone?


By John A. Lang on Sunday, May 12, 2002 - 8:39 pm:

The only things I can think of that'll be added are:

A. The moments in Engineering in which Peter Preston is identified as Scotty's nephew.
B. Preston's viewpoint of the Enterprise.
C. Kirk's remark to McCoy after Khan's 1st attack.
D. Additional dialogue between Kirk, Spock & Saavik as they climb the ladder to return to the Bridge.

(These were on the TV version that I could remember)

ANYTHING ELSE, ANYONE?


By Sven of Nine on Monday, May 13, 2002 - 12:57 am:

Wasn't there dialogue somewhere that established Saavik was in fact half-Vulcan, half-Romulan? (I'm not sure if it got to film or not)


By Adam Bomb on Monday, May 13, 2002 - 7:05 am:

No dialog in the film established Saavik's Vulcan/Romulan parentage, not on video, theaters or the TV version. Perhaps a scene alluding to this will be added; I think it was filmed.
If you remember, the added scenes did not have added sound effects. E.G. - After Kirk's mock scolding of Peter Preston in the ABC version (he was established as Scotty's sister's son at that time) Kirk got on the lift to ascend to the upper part of Engineering. The lift made such a racket, it interfered with the dialog. I assume this will be corrected.
As I said above, I DID purchase the six-pack, at that time against my better judgement. Now, I feel ripped off.


By MarkN on Tuesday, May 14, 2002 - 12:24 am:

According to "Entertainment Weekly," "Men In Black" is on its third DVD version. Overkill, anyone?
Well, LOTR is supposed to come out in like 3 or 4 versions as well, and some other movies have come out in several different DVD versions, too, like Highlander, which I saw last week on DVD. I'd never seen it before and it was B-A-D!!! Why the heck did it ever become so popular?

The TOS movie six-pack has the new TMP version but Paramount should've waited to give the other five films the same treatment before releasing them now in a box set. That's what I'm waiting for, or else I'll just rent them one at a time when they come out. I just hope they'll improve STV somewhat, like having the ridiculous numbers on the turbolift walls be fixed or removed would be a great start.


By Adam Bomb on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 7:15 am:

My mind just did a backflip when I realized that it's been 20 years since this pic was released in theaters.
I'm still undecided whether I'll cave in and buy the Special Edition, although at some point, I probably will.
Couldn't Paramount use a thinner DVD case, though? I mean, "Gladiator" is in a 2 DVD set, but the box is the same size as a single DVD case. That way, the S/E could still fit in to the same box I got when I bought the "six-pack" last November.


By Adm. Chrichton on Sunday, February 16, 2003 - 8:50 am:

Ricardo Montalbahn's haircut in that interview Tee Hee!


By Kinggodzillak on Thursday, May 19, 2005 - 4:02 pm:

Watched this today - noticed that when the Enterprise fires a torpedo at Reliant (just after that close-up of Kirk, fist clenched, saying "Fire!") there's a spare frame or two of that closeup sitting (I think) between two effects shots...


By Simon Maxwell on Wednesday, October 04, 2006 - 4:28 pm:

A small bit of new footage inserted right after Kirk says, "They just don't want us going in there" creates a new continuity error. A woman, who is passing behind Kirk's seat, vanishes in the first shot of the new footage, only to reappear in the shot of David entering the bridge from the turbolift.


By John A. Lang on Tuesday, December 26, 2006 - 10:51 am:

TRIVIA:
In July of 1979, Kirstie Alley, an interior designer from Kansas appeared as a contestant on "Match Game". She went all the way to "Super Match".

...and let me tell you...she looked PIPING HOT!!!


By Nove Rockhoomer on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 5:14 pm:

I agree, and I think the panelists agreed too. I never saw them drool over any other contestant as much as Kirstie.


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Saturday, January 06, 2007 - 8:39 pm:

Do you have the Match Game DVD, Nove?


By Nove Rockhoomer on Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 6:59 am:

No, I watch it on GSN.


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Wednesday, January 17, 2007 - 7:20 pm:

When Kirk leaves the simulator to meet Spock, there's a 20th century "EXIT" sign over the door.


By Josh M on Thursday, January 18, 2007 - 1:23 pm:

Like the smiley face symbol, it shall last for centuries. :-)


By Adam Bomb on Tuesday, April 17, 2007 - 11:11 am:

25th anniversary action figures here. (It has been that long, hasn't it?)


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Saturday, October 20, 2007 - 9:53 pm:

One of Gene Roddenberry's aides said at the Star Trek convention that Gene did not like the idea of Kirk killing the Ceti Alpha Eel creature. Gene felt that Kirk should've picked up the creature & given it to McCoy for analysis


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 1:25 pm:

BTW---it was Richard Arnold.


By Cybermortis on Sunday, May 18, 2008 - 2:06 pm:

When reviewing the damage done to the the Enterprise by the Reliant Spock comments that 'They knew exactly where to hit us', as if the weak spots on the ship were not common knowledge. This raises three nits;

Khan learnt about the Enterprises weak points by reading from the ships computer in TOS. If such information can be gained from the computer, and seems to be unclassified, why are they surprised that someone commanding another Starfleet ship wouldn't have access to that information?

The Reliant is a Starfleet ship, with a Starfleet crew as far as Spock knows. Wouldn't someone serving on the Reliant be familiar enough with Constitution class ships to know where to aim? Chekov is one crewmen on Reliant who would know. Even if you assume its not the Starfleet crew attacking you maybe they were forced to give the information out.

So, Starfleet spent at least 18 months rebuilding the Enterprise...and yet they left the ship with exactly the same weak points as she had in TOS? Wouldn't one of the reasons for such a major refit/rebuild be to remove deficiencies in the design? Wouldn't installing new systems result in at least some of them being moved to different locations?


Everyone keeps saying that the Genesis device is intended to terraform lifeless planets, and not designed as a weapon.
Well, lets ask one simple question. What would a Starship have that an uninhabited planet NOT have? (Apart from people).
Answer; Antimatter. Ships use anti matter for the warp drive, an uninhabited planet is a ball of rock. Yet for all this the device works just fine even though it is detonated on a starship carrying antimatter.

I'm starting to think that the Klingons are correct in assuming the Genesis device is a weapon. The only planets I can think of that may contain antimatter would be...inhabited.


By Merat on Monday, May 19, 2008 - 8:35 am:

It would rewrite all life to suit the Genesis matrix. In other words, it would kill them all.

Cybermortis:
I'm confused, what does the antimatter on the ship have to do with anything? Besides, it didn't really work all that well. The planet blows up.


By Cybermortis on Monday, May 19, 2008 - 10:32 am:

>>>By Merat on Monday, May 19, 2008 - 8:35 am:

Cybermortis:
I'm confused, what does the antimatter on the ship have to do with anything?<<<

The device is meant to work by re-arranging normal matter into new forms. However antimatter is not normal matter, nor is it something that would be naturally present on any planet. Hence it shouldn't be something the device was designed for or intended to change IF the GD really was intended for use solely on uninhabited worlds.

I would expect one of the following to happen;

As the device turns the storage containers into something else the antimatter is released. The mixture of matter and antimatter releases a vast amount of energy that destabilises the matrix and turns the GD into a huge bomb.

The GD manages to alter the AM, but uses up a large amount of energy resulting in flaws in the finished matrix.

None of the above seems to have happened. Although the Genesis planet turned out to be unstable David Marcus explains this as being due to using protomatter in the device. No one brings up the idea that it could have been the Antimatter the Reliant was carrying that screwed up the workings of the device. Since David was the designer of the GD and he never brings this possibility up, even when he's trying to hide that he used protomatter, we can only conclude that he (and Savik) know that antimatter would have no effect on the device.
The only way he could possibly know this would be if the device had either been tested with antimatter or if they'd calculated if it would work with AM. Given that the stated targets of the GD shouldn't have any antimatter on them this would seen a strange thing to test or look into.

The only explanation is that the possibility of there being antimatter on the target world was considered. And that in turn implies someone paid serious consideration to the possibility of using the Genesis device on worlds that were inhabited and may have had antimatter on them. In other words the Klingons seem to be quite correct that Genesis was designed as a weapon or a potential weapon.


By BF (Titanmanforever) on Monday, May 19, 2008 - 10:10 pm:

Cybermortis, I wouldn't say that there were "deficiencies" in the design. The first section Khan targeted was right along the warp core (which is rather large) and some of the other power systems, and on unshielded hull it was bound to cause heavy damager to the ship. The Enterprise, unlike the Defiant on DS9 or other ships, was never intended to go through combat without shields, so nearly any hit was going to damage something important. The key to the attack was that Kirk trusted another Starfleet ship enough to where he didn't raise shields, otherwise targeting that area probably wouldn't have been such a big problem.


By Cybermortis on Tuesday, May 20, 2008 - 6:38 pm:

Watch closely when Spock gives Kirk the damage report. He moves over to a display and points at the damaged sections as he says 'Whoever it is, they knew exactly where to hit us'. All of the highlighted areas of the display are small.

This seems to be saying that all of Reliants fire hit vital areas of the ship, and that this implied unusual knowledge of where to aim.

Now we know Khan got enough information about the Enterprise way back in TOS, since he used that knowledge to try and take over the ship. And from Spock's comment we are meant to assume Khan knew where to aim from his appearance in TOS.

The problem here is that regardless of how long it has been since Khan was on Enterprise we also know that the ship spent 18 months being rebuilt - including making the engineering section larger. So we are to conclude from all this that even with all the work done on the ship since TOS the Film Enterprise still has exactly the same weaknesses Khan read about 15 years before? Wouldn't plasma conduits and power cables have been moved around in that time? Wouldn't some of the systems have been shifted to completely different areas of the ship during the refit?


By TWS Garrison on Wednesday, May 21, 2008 - 12:01 am:

Now we know Khan got enough information about the Enterprise way back in TOS, since he used that knowledge to try and take over the ship. And from Spock's comment we are meant to assume Khan knew where to aim from his appearance in TOS.

Not necessarily. For example, Khan's good shooting could be a clue that he had mind-controlled someone who had served as the post-refit Enterprise's tactical officer.


By BF (Titanmanforever) on Wednesday, May 21, 2008 - 3:51 pm:

I always wondered about that too, it is a good point. But I don't think the warp core would've moved that far in the refit, and perhaps he filled in the gaps from Chekhov like TWS Garrison said.


By Cybermortis on Wednesday, May 21, 2008 - 6:34 pm:

Which adds to one of my first nits; Why does Spock seem surprised that 'They knew where to hit us?'

If we assume Khan knew then he got that information from the Enterprises database in TOS then we have to conclude that that information would also have been in Reliants database and unclassified. That ships have detailed information on other starship classes can be seen in TMP where the V'ger probe accesses Enterprises computer system - as it is doing this schematics for three other star ship classes can be seen. That the information must be unclassified can be concluded by Khan being able to get that information in TOS without tripping any security alarms or firewalls - OK Khan is smart but he's not smart enough to figure out how to hack a computer system some 250 years ahead of what he was used to without tripping any alarms.

(This does raise two nits 1 - Why do starfleet ships contain detailed schematics of other ship classes? If the ship is captured you've just handed a hostile force detailed information about your defences.
2 - Why is the information not highly classified?)

Whatever the reason Enterprise has been attacked by a Starfleet ship who's computer database has schematics of Enterprise. Plus you know that at least one of the officers served on Enterprise and could have been forced to give up the information. No matter how you look at it there is no reason for Spock to call Kirk over and imply there is something unusual at Reliant knowing where they should have aimed.
It would have been more surprising had Reliant NOT known where to aim, or had aimed at several locations that WERE vulnerable before Enterprise had been refitted. This would have told us that Khan was using outdated information on Enterprise when he attacked.

'Captain this is most interesting. They targeted this area, which is a non-vital area of deck 6. However prior to our refit it used to contain the primary power couplings for our port phasers'


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Wednesday, May 21, 2008 - 7:12 pm:

I know this may violate the Nitpicker Prime Directive, but I highly recommend the Trek novel To Reign In Hell: The Exile Of Khan Noonien Singh, by Greg Cox (the same guy who wrote the two excellent Eugenics Wars novels).

This book tackles a lot of questions the movie raised. A couple of examples below.

1. How did Khan recognize Chekov? In the novel, it is revealed that Chekov was in charge of the security detail that accomapanied Khan and his followers down to Ceti Alpha V when the Enterprise dropped them off.

2. How come many of Khan's followers appeared so much younger than he did? They were in fact the children of his original followers. Their accelarated growth was due to the genetic engineering done to their parents. The character of Joachim, who appears in the movie, is the son of Joaquin, who appeared on Space Seed.

I highly recommend this novel for fans of this movie.


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Wednesday, May 21, 2008 - 9:37 pm:

I always thought Joachim was Khan's son.


By Cyber (Cybermortis) on Tuesday, June 24, 2008 - 8:08 pm:

Not sure if this has been brought up before, so sorry if it has.

Does the torpedo Spock is buried in seem large enough for his body to have fitted into? We get to see Spock next to a torpedo casing in Undiscovered country and I could swear that he is taller than the casing is long


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Monday, December 08, 2008 - 8:18 pm:

Deleted scenes


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Monday, July 13, 2009 - 11:12 am:

Nicholas Meyer has written a book about his Trek experiences, titled The View from the Bridge: Memories of Star Trek and a Life in Hollywood. It will be released 8/20/09, and more information can be obtained here.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Tuesday, February 01, 2011 - 2:04 pm:

This movie is now available on Blu-Ray. It's the theatrical version, however, not the "SE-DVD" version. The package has a nit, though - the shot of Kirk on it was taken from Star Trek III.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Wednesday, March 02, 2011 - 8:13 am:

Trek movies II and IV will be re-issued in a special, low-priced two-pack, in both DVD and Blu-Ray, on 3/29/11. More here.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Wednesday, March 30, 2011 - 7:27 am:

The Blu-Ray has a nit on its label (besides the fact that the label is the same battleship gray color that Paramount has used on their video discs for at least a year and a half.) The movie is titled Star Trek - The Wrath of Khan on the label. No "II" at all. If you remember, the theatrical prints bore that same title; the "II" was not added until the video release in November 1982. (The film's advertising [commercials, posters etc.] always used the "II".) Picture quality of the Blu-Ray viewed on an HDTV is top-notch. Compared to the old bare-bones DVD I have, I was blown away by just how good it it. Too bad it's the theatrical version and not the extended "director's cut". I wanted to have that scene where Kirk is needling Cadet Preston about how bad the Enterprise is, and Preston gives it right back to Kirk.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Wednesday, April 13, 2011 - 2:03 pm:

There's a "Rifftrax" now available for this movie, which will work with either the theatrical or Director's cut. Price is $3.99.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Tuesday, November 01, 2011 - 7:30 am:

Nicholas Meyer will write, and Oliver Stone will direct, a movie for HBO titled The Power Broker. It's based on a book by Robert Caro about New York City's "master builder", Robert Moses. (I hope they don't sugar-coat the Brooklyn Dodgers' 1957 defection to L.A., for which Moses carries a lot of the blame.)


By Mike on Saturday, May 28, 2011 - 12:18 pm:

I'm curious,was there ever any explanation as to why Checkov & the captain of the Reliant simply did not call for an emergency beam up while they were inside the Botany Bay once Checkov realized the danger they were in? Instead they go outside & run smack dab into Khan & his followers & are captured.


By Luigi_novi (Luigi_novi) on Saturday, June 15, 2013 - 2:11 pm:

Good for him. I can't stand it when loser fanboys in the audience during panel discussions at conventions ask stupid $%^&** like that. Some guy tried the same nonsense with Marina Sirtis when she came to the convention held at the convention center down the block from the theater where I worked in the mid-to-late 90s, saying that she should've adjusted the shield frequencies when the Klingons attacked in Star Trek Generations, and blah, blah, blah. The audience groaned when the guy said this, and Sirtis, to her credit, simply said that she wasn't going to answer technobabble questions and moved on.


By John A. Lang (Johnalang) on Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - 8:42 pm:

Marina always says, "That planet came out of nowhere"


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Thursday, April 09, 2015 - 7:50 am:

Here's another review of this movie. It's from the blog "Shatner's Toupee", so you get a lot of hirsute toupee talk.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Monday, December 07, 2015 - 11:00 am:

I noticed a strange discussion in Board 2, January 2000, of this movie between 'Anonymous', Chris Thomas, 'mf', and Benn Allen about what rank and position Chekov had on the Reliant.
Benn even states that he scanned parts with Chekov in it and ascertained that he wasn't first officer.
I should point out that he most certainly is First Officer. The first time we see the Reliant flying overhead and then towards Ceti Alpha V, Koenig's voice-over is;
"Starship log, stardate 8130.4. Log entry by First Officer Pavel Chekov." he then goes on to describe their mission in connection to Genesis. No rank stated, but definitely absolutely a position.
Someone even thought he said 'duty officer', but 'duty' and 'first' don't sound anything alike, not to mention one has one sylable and the other two.
Strange how the ears can play tricks on us.
And speaking of ears...
When the eel slithers out of Chekov's ear and is zapped by Kirk's phaser, I always considered the sound effect as that of the eel's remains bubbling away, not a screech from a non-existent lifeform.
As much as I like the whole 'Have you ever piloted a starship out of spacedock before, Saavik/Would you like a tranquilizer?' scene for the laughs, it really doesn't make sense. Why should Kirk worry? Saavik issued a couple orders, and good ol' reliable expert Sulu piloted the ship out.

And why is it called 'spacedock' when that's the official name for the giant space station seen in Star Trek III? Wouldn't that confuse people who want go to 'Space Dock' but are taken to a DRY dock?

Pretty bad idea by the 'engineers who love to change things', by having shields activated on just one side at a time, until it comes full circle around your ship. I would think that that would be an extremely bad tactical idea, especially as the shields seem to activate starting near the rear, work around the front, and finish at the rear. Most of the time your enemy will start firing from in front of you.

Just prior to Kirk, McCoy, and Saavik beaming over to Regula 1, the station is seen in silhouette against what must be the star that becomes the sun of Genesis. There's no nebula in sight from that angle, just a brilliant light.

When the Reliant explodes the nebula instantly fades. Why? The nebula just evaporates before the explosion spreads out far enough to touch it.

The Reliant returns to Regula 1 to confront the Enterprise, but Khan only seens the station and the dead rock, presumably because we later find out that the Enterprise has been hiding at the bottom of the moon. But the Reliant approached from a great distance, and should have seen it sitting below the moon. I suppose somehow Spock knew enough to hide behind the moon.

Lucky for Kirk that his eyes never bothered him again in The Search For Spock, The Voyage Home, The Final Frontier, The Undiscovered Country, or Generations, despite the passage of many years.

And speaking of that, isn't McCoy a great practical joker? He gives Kirk eye glasses for his birthday and a bottle of Romulan ale. If Kirk wears his glasses and drinks too much ale, his vision will blur and he'll tell McCoy that his glasses don't work! One present helps his eyes, the other messes them up!

When the Enterprise is escaping from the Reliant during the Genesis countdown, they appear to be travelling at roughly an 80 degree angle from each other, nearly flying in the same direction. Shouldn't the Enterprise have left at a 180 degree angle, completely opposite of Reliant's course? That puny 4000 kilometers could have been more like 6000 at that rate.

That hunk of ceiling comes down on Joachim, and Khan picks it up, struggles with it, and tosses it away. HE TOSSES IT AWAY! I realize it was a way of showing the great strength that Khan possesses, but wouldn't it have been easier for Khan to just lift one edge up and off Joachim, and set it down away from the guy? Good thing he's not a furniture mover! He'd lift your couch up and throw it in the truck by himself!


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Monday, April 25, 2016 - 7:35 am:

Another way to separate Trek fans from their money: The "Director's Edition" of WOK will be released on Blu-Ray June 7, 2016. More here. One package nitpick - why is Uhura missing from it?


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Friday, June 10, 2016 - 9:34 am:

I recently read a book about the costumes of star Trek, from the Original series to Enterprise, and it was loaded with photos, as well. Something I discovered was that the cadet uniforms used in Star Trek II and thereafter (the maroon ones with the beige shoulders), are actually the Star Trek - The Motion Picture uniforms! Those crappy pale blue and pale yellow uniforms were dyed maroon and stitched differently to become the cadet uniforms. I don't think the wavy lives that went down the chest and abdomen of the shirt can be seen too clearly on TV but in the photos you can clearly see the original STTMP design.

I still think it's odd that the producers of the movies didn't think that the Original series uniforms would work on the big screen, and yet what did J.J. Abrahms give us? Updated Original series uniforms that look perfectly fine.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 8:21 am:

The "Director's Edition" of WOK will be released on Blu-Ray June 7, 2016.

Not having the DVD, I don't know how different that is from the Blu-Ray. The shot of Sulu facing and addressing "Captain" Saavik, when the text disappears from the viewscreen, was replaced with a replay of a viewscreen shot from earlier in the film. This now creates a continuity error, as we see Sulu turn toward the screen when he was never facing away from it.
Also, in the (added) scene after the beam-up from the Genesis cave, when Kirk and Spock crawl through the bowels of the ship, the dialog where Kirk tells Spock that the "young man" is his son (and Spock says, rather disinterestedly, "Faaascinating") was dropped. But, the music cue (that was used when this scene was added back for TV runs) was kept.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Thursday, June 23, 2016 - 7:38 am:


quote:

The shot of Sulu facing and addressing "Captain" Saavik, when the text disappears from the viewscreen, was replaced with a replay of a viewscreen shot from earlier in the film.



That's an editing mistake, and the disc is being recalled because of it. More here.
Should I send mine back, or should I keep it, thinking it wil become a collector's item? Or, as that Clash song (which is now used in commercials for Choice Hotels) asks "Should I stay or should I go?"


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Friday, September 23, 2016 - 3:59 pm:

I'll always consider James Horner a genius, and the creator of my favorite Star Trek soundtrack, but I was surprised to hear that he had a little 'help' in creating his masterpiece.
According to the new book, 'The 50-Year Mission', when Harve Bennet heard it for the first time he recognized several parts that seemed very similar to something called 'Prokofiev - Alexander Nevsky 5 The Battle on Ice', since he was such a fan of classical music.

Here's a link below for a Youtube selection. If you know the music from 'The Battle In The Mutara Nebula', you'll recognize a couple bits of it at the 2 minute mark, 4 minute mark, and 4:40 mark.

https://youtu.be/-oRbStmxvm4


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Tuesday, July 11, 2017 - 6:18 am:

Ironic that Kirk asks Spock, "Meaning you can't even beam us back?" (to the Enterprise, after they beamed over to Regula One). Meanwhile...he and the others are in the Regula One TRANSPORTER ROOM! Granted, it was all a ploy to trick Khan (hours instead of days in code), but the reality is is that they could have beamed over to any part of the Enterprise using the station's transporters.


By ScottN (Scottn) on Tuesday, July 11, 2017 - 8:43 am:

The only irony is that the ruse was done in the transporter room. I don't think it's a nit, as you said, it was to fool the Klingons. So the fact that they could have beamed over any time is irrelevant.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Thursday, July 13, 2017 - 6:19 am:

You mean to fool Khan.


By ScottN (Scottn) on Wednesday, July 26, 2017 - 5:22 pm:

You're right. Khan.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Saturday, August 05, 2017 - 11:04 pm:

This film is returning to theaters for a two-night engagement celebrating its 35th anniversary, courtesy of Fathom Events, on September 10 and 13. More here.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Monday, September 18, 2017 - 10:44 am:

At the Fathom Events screening, one piece of trivia dropped was that it was Catherine Coulson, who worked on the film as a first assistant camera person, who shot the ending of this film. Coulson later gained fame as the Log Lady on Twin Peaks. She passed away on 7/28/2015, age 71.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Monday, December 17, 2018 - 5:08 am:

Why did they give Kirk a son in this film, only to kill him off in the next one?


By Keith Alan Morgan (Kmorgan) on Monday, December 17, 2018 - 5:32 pm:

Well, technically, they had no idea there was going to be a next film when they were making this one, so it's not like they were thinking ahead about cheap plot devices.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Tuesday, December 18, 2018 - 5:18 am:

Ah, David, we hardly knew ye!


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Sunday, September 08, 2019 - 5:27 pm:


quote:

No dialog in the film established Saavik's Vulcan/Romulan parentage...Perhaps a scene alluding to this will be added; I think it was filmed


.
The scene was shot; it's a line or two that extends the early conversation between Kirk and Spock. Google something like "Saavik Romulan"; it will turn up. Wonder why it wasn't added to the "Director's Edition" from a few years ago.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Thursday, November 28, 2019 - 11:30 am:

I wonder who added the eerie, sci-fi music to the Genesis Device proposal video-- Carol or David? :-)
I gotta wonder how Spock, McCoy, Scotty, Sulu, AND Uhura all agreed to taking teaching positions at Starfleet Academy at the same time? Did they have no choice, because they were assigned to the Enterprise and the Enterprise was assigned trainee-ship status? Or was Spock offered the position, and the others just agreed? Wouldn't Sulu and Uhura, at least, want to stay on a regular ship and further their careers? I started wondering how all five of them went along with this career choice, and I can't answer it.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Sunday, December 01, 2019 - 5:11 am:

Well, you could ask the same question about Picard and his crew after the D was destroyed, and before the E was built. Yes, Worf ended up going to DS9, but the only reason that happened was because Sisko needed someone to handle the Klingon situation that was brewing at the time.

Perhaps it's a loyalty thing.


By Francois Lacombe (Franc0is) on Sunday, June 14, 2020 - 6:47 pm:

Neat recreation of the battle between Enterprise and Reliant


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Monday, June 15, 2020 - 5:11 am:

Nice :-)


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Friday, July 17, 2020 - 10:25 am:

Here's an interview with producer Robert Sallin. Check out that photo of him with the Genesis Device.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Monday, July 20, 2020 - 5:10 am:

Hey, thanks for posting this.


By Adam Bomb (Abomb) on Sunday, July 26, 2020 - 10:25 am:

You're most welcome, Tim.


By Natalie Salat (Nataliesalat) on Monday, July 27, 2020 - 3:02 am:

Why is Khan so amoral? higher intelligence shouldn't make you a monster?


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Monday, July 27, 2020 - 5:08 am:

Because, by this point, Khan was bats**t insane.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Monday, July 27, 2020 - 6:03 am:

Don't forget-- he spent 15 years on a devastated planet, watched his friends and fellow supermen die a few at a time, and worst of all, his wife, Marla McGivers, died a horrible death from the Ceti eels.
That'd be enough to drive anyone over the edge of sanity.


By Judi Jeffreys, Granada in NorthWest (Jjeffreys_mod) on Monday, July 27, 2020 - 1:46 pm:

Most real life human "monsters' are crude and unsophisticated - Kim Jong-il being a fan of the Warner Bros. cartoons, Charles Taylor of Liberia sipping a beer as the man he overthrew was tortured to death.


By Keith Alan Morgan (Kmorgan) on Tuesday, July 28, 2020 - 3:34 am:

Most real life human "monsters' are crude and unsophisticated [snip] being a fan of the Warner Bros. cartoons

Soooo... being a fan of Warners Bros. cartoons makes one a monster?

Why is Khan so amoral? higher intelligence shouldn't make you a monster?

Many things make someone a monster and some monsters are highly intelligent (think psychopaths or the Nazi scientists who conducted horrible experiments on people).

We also don't know what was done in the eugenics program or how these supermen were raised. They may have had increased aggression or were raised to believe they were better than everyone else.

Also what we see are the survivors of the program and the Eugenics Wars, so they had to be tougher and more ruthless to survive.

For all we know there could have been supermen who were all "peace, love, let's hold hands and sing koombyah", but they were probably killed early in the wars and we never heard about them.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Tuesday, July 28, 2020 - 5:10 am:

I watched the Warner Brothers cartoons. As far as I know, I've never tried to conquer the world.


Anyhoo...

Khan was right in pointing out that no one came to check up on them. Couldn't Starfleet have sent a ship by there every so often.

They wouldn't have to beam down. Just scan from orbit, report back that everything is okay, and leave.

Of course, if that had happened, we'd have no movie!


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Thursday, July 30, 2020 - 5:12 am:

A few of the posts here violated my stay on topic rule, so I Copied And Pasted them over to where they should be:


Nitcentral's Bulletin Brash Reflections: The Kitchen Sink: Media (TV, Print, Sports, etc.): TV More or Less: Specific Show Discussions: Cartoons: Looney Tunes


Thank you.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Thursday, January 21, 2021 - 11:24 am:

Kirk is 'celebrating' his birthday in this movie with McCoy, but it's not his real birthday, it's more a celebration of the 'day of his birthday' That's because Kirk is a little older than the 50 years (or is it 48 or 49?) than he actually is, thanks to some time travel exploits.
He fell behind about 3 days after the time warp at the end of 'The Naked Time', and several days when he and Spock spent time in 1930's New York in 'City On The Edge Of Forever' (Scott says he and Spock 'just left a moment ago', so several days were compressed into a few seconds of real time).
And then there's unspecified time elapsed in real time as the Enterprise travels back to 1969 to avoid a black star and returns home in 'Tomorrow Is Yesterday'.
So Kirk is celebrating his birthday on March 22nd, but he's actually 2 weeks or so older than he would be without time travel.


By Francois Lacombe (Franc0is) on Thursday, January 21, 2021 - 1:44 pm:

You forgot the time he spent running after Gary Seven in Assignment: Earth


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Friday, January 22, 2021 - 5:08 am:

But Kirk was still born on that day, no matter how much be time travelled. So he's correct in saying that it's his birthday.

If I travelled to the past, stayed there a year, and then returned, October 28th would still be my birthday.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Friday, January 22, 2021 - 11:32 am:

That's right, but I'm pointing out that his body isn't the same age as his birthday, because he's lived let's say 2 weeks more than what's on his 23rd century calendar. It's actually a couple weeks older. So he's celebrating 50 years and 2 weeks of age on his birthday with McCoy.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Saturday, January 23, 2021 - 5:11 am:

Sorry Steve, I misunderstood you.

The way I read it, I thought you were saying the actual day of his birth had changed.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Saturday, February 27, 2021 - 10:31 am:

Kirk; "Romulan ale! Why, Bones, you know this stuff's illegal?"
McCoy; "I only use it for medicinal purposes!"

Sounds like McCoy follows some of the medical teachings of Doctor Phlox...
...and then Scotty smacked him in the head and told him, "Ya bogus-frat! It's fer drinkin'! Now, gi' us yer glass!"


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Thursday, May 13, 2021 - 7:12 pm:

Youtube strikes again!
A new fan-made video has Kirk's shuttle approach the Spacedock space station, instead of a mere drydock, and the ship leaves (in a rather unique way) from the station as well.
Check it out.

https://youtu.be/X3x-lIvcKr8


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Saturday, May 15, 2021 - 5:20 am:

Nice video.


By Francois Lacombe (Franc0is) on Sunday, September 24, 2023 - 11:17 am:

Why was Khan so sure that Kirk would be the one coming to investigate the trouble at Regula? He had just been told that Kirk was now an admiral, and admirals don't typically handle such missions themselves, they dispatch ships to do it for them.

The first battle between Enterprise and Reliant is a cinematic masterpiece. It does, however, contain a flaw that really bugs me. We know Kirk is a superb tactician, as shown in many episodes of TOS. He is being approached by a ship he cannot make contact with, and has been reminded of the regulation applying to such a situation. He is concerned enough to order yellow alert. Spock tells him that the situation on Reliant does not correspond to what Reliant is reporting, whoever is on that ship is lying to them. And yet, Kirk does not order to raise shields until it is too late. Kirk is incapable of this level of incompetence. The only reason he does not raise shields the moment Spock tells him that Reliant's coil emissions are normal is because the script needs those shields to be down when Khan attacks. That's it. Sloppy bit of writing in an otherwise superb scene.

That being said, when Enterprise opens fire on Reliant, why didn't they target the bridge, the place where they knew Khan and most of his crew were located?


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Monday, September 25, 2023 - 4:33 pm:

It's quite possible they did, Francois, because I just reviewed the battle on Youtube to find an answer for you.
The first phaser beams Enterprise fires come SOOO close to the starboard side of the bridge (only a few metres), just BARELY misses it, and hits the rear engineering section, then the second destroys the engineering dome. Reliant was moving and it's always harder to hit a moving target, but your tactic appears to be what Sulu (who locked phasers) had in mind.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Tuesday, September 26, 2023 - 2:30 pm:

Could be.

Still a damned good movie.


By Francois Lacombe (Franc0is) on Tuesday, September 26, 2023 - 5:52 pm:

Reliant was moving and it's always harder to hit a moving target

Plus, Enterprise had sustained a lot of damage, which probably made it a lot harder to keep a solid phaser lock. I like.


By Keith Alan Morgan (Kmorgan) on Wednesday, September 27, 2023 - 1:13 am:

Was Kirk aiming the phasers without his glasses? ;-)

Yeah, yeah, automated systems and computer aiming etc.


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Tuesday, October 03, 2023 - 10:15 pm:

Greg Cox's novel, To Reign In Hell: The Exile Of Khan Noonien Singh, takes a look at what happened to Khan and Co. between the events of Space Seed and this movie.

It's a good read, IMO.

I mention this because Greg is part of the same TOS Facebook group as me.


By steve McKinnon (Steve) on Thursday, November 02, 2023 - 5:59 pm:

In his quarters, Spock tells Kirk, "If I may be so bold, it was a mistake for you to accept promotion. Commanding a starship is your first, best destiny. Anything else is a waste of material."

This is ironic given that Spock, who has been called the 'best first officer in the fleet' and the best SCIENCE officer in Starfleet, would accept a new job, himself-- namely command of the Enterprise.
HE is wasting his own 'first, best destiny' as an excellent science officer in favour of commanding a ship full of cadets (and not even a SCIENCE vessel).


By Tim McCree (Tim_m) on Friday, November 03, 2023 - 5:08 am:

Fun that one can still find nits in a movie that came out 41 years ago.


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