It's interesting to find out that the Federation has become the equivalent of the USA military in the 20th/21st century. This episode has revealed that they have recently been at war with the Talarians. The Federation has become the "Universe's Police" much like the USA is viewed as the "World's Police" by some politicians.

Also, if Jono had succeeded in stabbing Picard in the heart, would it have killed him? Or could Picard's bionic heart withstand the blade? (The knife blade glanced off his sternum, so says Crusher)

The Enterprise enters Talarian territory to rescue the boys, but later Worf reports on 2 Talarian warships on the other side of the border.

Jono refuses to take off his gloves so he doesn't touch anything alien, but he is willing to eat ice cream that Wes has already eaten some of?

Derf, I wonder if Jono would have been electrocuted if the blade had hit Picard's heart. ;-)

Derf: It's interesting to find out that the Federation has become the equivalent of the USA military in the 20th/21st century. This episode has revealed that they have recently been at war with the Talarians. The Federation has become the "Universe's Police" much like the USA is viewed as the "World's Police" by some politicians.

Luigi Novi: The U.S. isn't referred to as the "World's Police" because it's "been involved in wars". It's been referred to as such because of the perception (accurate or not) that it has invaded sovereign countries for interests other than humanitarian, and because of all the covert wars it's participated in.

Whether the Federation is the "Alpha Quadrant's Police" ("Universe" seems a bit out of scale) wouldn't depend merely on whether it's gone to war, it would depend on whether or not the wars it fought with others were justified, and the motives for those wars. If it went to war because it was defending itself against an aggressor, or defending an ally, there's nothing "Police" about it. Of the five wars we know Earth/the Federation has fought, the only one whose details we have knowledge of was the Federation-Dominion War. We have no knowledge of the political or military motives behind the Federation's involvement in the Earth/Romulan War(Balance of Terror(TOS)), the Federation/Talarian War, the Fedeation/Cardassian War (The Wounded) or the Federation/Tzenkethi War(The Adversary(DS9)).

KAM: Jono refuses to take off his gloves so he doesn't touch anything alien, but he is willing to eat ice cream that Wes has already eaten some of?

Luigi Novi: Perhaps he just softened up a bit towards the crew by then.

Or was really, really hungry?

I dunno, but if an ice cream exploaded in my face i'd do my block. Slapstick funny? What is this? the 1920's or the 24th century

In a future where music is represented by jazz (gachck) and classical (double gachck), Jono's 'Adeb'ra'a' was very refreshing to this old Metalhead.

I agree that the banana split in the face was amusing.

Who wrote this episode anyway? The D.C.F.S.?

INSULTING MOMENT:
In the transmission, the old woman describes herself as "your father's mother".

Why did she say that?

Why not say "Grandma", or "Grandmother", lady?

Why did she seem to think that Jono wouldn't know the meaning of the word?

Certainly they have grandparents on Jono's adopted world....so I found her terminology insulting.

No wonder he didn't want to go to her.

Maybe "father's mother" is indeed the proper traditional term for "grandma" on the planet and the admiral knows this?

I assumed she just wanted to specify their exact connection. It's not the most common terminology, but it's used sometimes. Bubba used it in Forrest Gump.

Then in Jono's case, it'd be "Forrest GRUMP"!

I can't help but wonder what Admiral Rossa said after hearing from Picard that Jono was allowed to leave with the Tellarians.

I must add that this story must have been co-written by O.J. Simpson....seeing how Jono was let go so easily after trying to kill Picard.

Erm, John A., I hope that was supposed to be a joke...'cause I don't really feel I should have to explain the difference between a grown man brutally knifing down his ex-wife and a witness out of sheer narcissism and the misguided-but-desperate act of a teenager in whose culture acts of violence are a common way to express emotion.

Your point about Admiral Rossa is very valid, though - I've wondered the same thing myself. There may not be much she could do in terms of reclaiming her grandson but I bet Picard suddenly and mysteriously got turned down for a LOT of promotions right about then...

Certainly they have grandparents on Jono's adopted world....so I found her terminology insulting.

Why? As Luigi says, she just wants to make it very clear what their relationship is...'father's mother' as opposed to 'mother's mother', if nothing else. Simple, and to my mind indicative of how very interested and excited she is re: her grandson.

It was a joke. Sarcasm too. The story was poorly written. I have a hard time watching it. I moan like Jono when the episode ends.

I thought this episode was very prescient, given the Elian Gonzalez issue years later. The episode took the right position on the matter, IMO.

Luigi Novi: The U.S. isn't referred to as the "World's Police" because it's "been involved in wars". It's been referred to as such because of the perception (accurate or not) that it has invaded sovereign countries for interests other than humanitarian, and because of all the covert wars it's participated in.

:: "We've got to protect all our citizens fair
So we'll send a battalion for everyone there
And maybe we'll leave in a couple of years
'Cause we're the cops of the world, boys
We're the cops of the world." Phil Ochs.

Before Picard has Jono beamed back to his father's ship, there were THREE Talarian ships on the screen. However, after they beamed Jono back, there was only ONE Talarian ship.

I fail to understand why Picard is wrestling with the question of Jono's disposition....
Here's a big reason to return Jono: THE PRIME DIRECTIVE! The Enterprise is in Talarian space, they are bound by Talarian laws & it was Jono's decision to return to the Talarian ship. The question was moot. Return the boy.

Not necessarily. Jeremiah was kidnapped as a child, and his grandmother, a Starfleet admiral, wanted him back. That makes the situation a bit more complicated, but yeah, I think Elian-er, I mean Jono should have gone back, and thankfully, Picard realized that.

If Electron is right, and Admiral Rossa is acknowledging Talarian custom by calling herself Jono's father's mother, she would be the only person from the Federation who shows any knowledge of Talarian culture in this whole episode. Neither Troi nor Crusher knew that taking off a Talarian's gloves is like trying to take off their pants. They don't understand the significance of the B'nar, and tell him to stop, which is like ordering a person to stop crying because it offends you. Picard didn't know that Endar would make his claim to Jono based on Talarian customs about losing one's own child. He also didn't know that Talarian boys play rough games and get hurt, which is a perfectly reasonable explanation of his injuries. Why did he not prepare to meet with Endar by looking up information about Talarian law and customs on the computer, so he wouldn't look ignorant? Of course, he assumed at one point that the Talarians are monsters who abducted Jono to abuse him.

About Jono's decision to stay with Endar, why is it so hard to believe that a human raised in an alien culture would be happy in that culture? Why do they initially jump to the conclusion that his wish to return to Endar, the only father he has ever known, is some kind of Stockholm syndrome? Surely, at least one of them would see Jono's situation as similar to his own, namely Worf. Also, they should have given Jono the benefit of the doubt about him being able to make his own decisions, since Wesley was about his age when he received his acting ensign commission.

Finally, I agree with King Mob's point about Talarian popular music. It is nice to see a culture whose young men rock out to loud music instead of listening exclusively to classical music. Heck, it's nice just to see a culture that has popular music.

I agree that this ep made the right decision, respecting his wishes to return to the only culture and the only father he's ever known. I like the ending much better than the DS9 episdode with the Cardassian child who's father wanted him back.

ALTERNATE SCRIPT:

Jono: What are you going to show me now?
Picard: I'm going to teach you how to play racket ball.
Jono: Don't you mean "Racquetball"?

(Several minutes later after the game...)

Jono: Ah...I see you were right. It IS "RACKET Ball"

I just caught the end of the episode, so I'm not completely sure how the gloves and lack of touching alien species. However, after Jono takes his gloves off to touch Picard, he doesn't put them back on before he beams out. Aren't the Talarians going ot be upset about the fact taht he has his gloves off after being on a non-alien ship? Won't they suspect something?

Also, when they express surprise abuot the fact that he has injuries from games, and think that he was severely abused, it suggests that this is unknown among humans. Don't they commonly play something called "Paressi's Squares" that from all descriptions seems like a very rough game?

Certainly Worf knows of some rough Klingon games if the Federation has become too "enlightened" for contact sports. :-)

Pentalarc: Aren't the Talarians going ot be upset about the fact taht he has his gloves off after being on a non-alien ship? Won't they suspect something?
Luigi Novi: Jono did not indicate that his feelings about touching aliens was a law, or even a strongly stigmatized taboo. Only that that was how he felt.

Pentalarc: Also, when they express surprise abuot the fact that he has injuries from games, and think that he was severely abused, it suggests that this is unknown among humans. Don't they commonly play something called "Paressi's Squares" that from all descriptions seems like a very rough game?
Luigi Novi: Pathologists and medical examiners can determine if injuries are sustained by things like falls, or by impacts resulting from physical force exerted by another party. They can even tell if impact is the result of an object hitting a person, or the person being hit by an object swung at that person. Episodes like Suspicions(TNG) and Meld(VOY) established that CMO's have such expertise.

If Jono sustained these injuries through physical fighting (at least in part, since Endar claimed that at least some of Jono's injuries may have been sustained by a riding animal).

On the other hand, you may be right that they jumped to conclusions because of Jono's age. They may not have thought of Parisses Squares because Future Imperfect(TNG) indicated that Parisses Squares was considered too dangerous a sport for teenagers.

Interestingly (though it's not obvious on screen) those Talarian ships are heavily modified models of Imperial Star Destroyers from Star Wars. The models also show up again in Emissary (DS9) as Frunalian science vessels, and another DS9 episode which I can't remember as science vessels of yet another race.

Re: Luigi Nova Re: Differing types of injuries. I understand what you're saying, but I still think it's a big jump for them to make. Let's take a current sport. If someone gets hit with a stick in hockey or lacrosse, once that injury is healed, how would someone be able to tell if the injury was from being attacked, or from playing a rough sport. Even if they did seem like physical fighting, martial arts certainly don't seem unknown in the Federation. Wouldn't it be just as likely that Jono is into the Talarian version of kickboxing?

Re: Luigi Nova Re: Parisses Squares: I really wish they had told us more about this game. They seem rather inconsistant now that I think about the statement you mention from Future Imperfect. I'm currently watching Timescape (which made me think of this discussion, and decide to check it) and at the beginning of it, Crusher tells Riker he can't play Parisses Squares like "he's still 21". . .seems like a narrow range of "acceptable" ages for players.

How do you figure. The average pro athleat is over the hill by his mid-20s. That doesn't mean that he can't play the game but he can't play like he could when he was 21.

Pentalarc, my last name is not Nova.

As for Crusher's comment to Riker, she didn't say that it wasn't acceptable for him to play it, only that he couldn't play it as if he were still 21, which makes sense. When you're in your thirties, your body undergoes changes, and you have to be more careful with certain rigorous sports. Boxing comes to mind. People can box into their 30's, but it wouldn't be unusual for a doctor to tell a boxer that they can't necessarily box like they could when they were 21.

I apolgize for the mistakes in name, I tend to type very fast. I sometimes type my own handle "Pentalard" or "Pentalarf"

I suppose you're right, I guess I'd just like to know a lot more about teh game.

Pentalarc
Where Five Roads Meet he Stands

Don't sweat it. When in doubt, remember: I'm not a Chevy or an exploding star, I'm the word "new" in Latin.

Geez, it just flows. I'm sure that'll pop into my head every time.

Hey, it turns out that Chad Allen is gay. Not that there's anything wrong with that. I just thought it was interesting. Carry on. Please. Sorry. Look, I'm sorry okay? jeez. Sorry.

No way! That kid that every little teeny bopper girl drooled over? Man, that's an ironic shock.

Chad Allen (Jono) was Matthew Cooper on "Dr Quinn, Medicine Woman," and was also Tommy Westphall for several episodes on "St. Elsewhere."

Sherman Howard (Endar) has a very interesting film career. He was the "domesticated" dead guy Bub in "Day of the Dead," the nefarious Lex Luthor on the "Superboy" TV show, and menaced Batman as Blight on "Batman Beyond."

Barbara Townsend (Admiral Rossa) was Colonel Potter's wife, the beloved Mildred, on the first season of the not-so-beloved "AfterMASH."

IIRC Sherman Howard was the second actor to play Lex on Superboy. The first season had a different Lex.

At one point, Jono is quite upset and wishes to be at home where he could run at the river to get rid of the pent-up energy. Picard takes him to the holodeck (I presume its one) and shows him how to play racketball.

Why not call up a generic holodeck setting of a river and let Jono run for some time, to cool down, and think things over for himself? (Esp. considering how often people in a crisis are left sitting alone on the Enterprise in other Ep.s). I think running in a natural-looking enviroment would be more calming than trying to concentrate and learn a new game!

And the Bill Clinton Award for Klingon least able to “feel your pain” goes to…
I’m surprised that Worf, of all people, finds Jono’s making the B’Nar disturbing. Aside from the fact that Jono is now in his quarters, isn’t the B’Nar somewhat similar to the “howl of pain” that Klingons participate in when mourning a fallen warrior, as seen in Heart of Glory? I would think that Worf could sympathize.
He’s hoping the glare coming off Picard’s head won’t be as severe
Data informs the senior staff of Jono’s true identity in the observation lounge. Instead of using the viewscreen right behind him, which is right in front of the crew members sitting down, he uses the viewscreen at the opposite end of the lounge.
Not really. One was his punching bag, and the other was a conquest.
One of the interesting contrasts between Kirk and Picard is that Kirk was said to be a stiff, morose bookworm in his youth, particularly his Academy days, and became somewhat more laid back and daring later on, as he mentioned to Bones in Shore Leave(TOS), whereas Picard was a bit of a wild hellraiser in youth, and became more of a stoic, disciplined man later in life after his fight with the Nausicaans, as established in Samaritan Snare and Tapestry. But in this episode, when Troi urges Picard to continue supervising Jono, he indicates that he had no youth or friends because he was too devoted to his dream of Starfleet. The episode Tapestry later contradicts this. Weren’t Cortin Zweller and Marta Batanides his friends?
Picard and Troi are apparently the same type of people as those parents who leave their kids alone with Michael Jackson
Crusher tells Picard in Act 3 that Endar’s meeting with Jono should be supervised, and that they should not be left alone. In accordance with this, when Endar and Jono are reunited in the observation lounge in Act 3, Picard and Troi turn around to face the wall to give the father and son some semblance of privacy, such as it is. But in the next scene, in the beginning of Act 4, Picard and Troi come out of the observation lounge onto the bridge, apparently having left Endar alone with Jono.
Yeah, really, I mean it is Chad Allen, after all. Just pick up the latest copy of Forensic Teen Beat.
Admiral Connaught Rossa, Jono’s biological grandmother, sends him a message, and among the things she says is, “I find myself wondering what you look like. All I can do is imagine your father at your age.” This seems odd. Artists, forensic pathologists and computer experts today can project what a missing person will look like in future with incredible accuracy, so long as they have a photo of the child, and a photo of at least one parent when the parent was at the current age of the child, particularly if the child strongly resembles one parent over the other. We know there are records of both young Jeremiah and his parents, so wouldn’t 24th century technology be even better equipped than our current tech? Riker used this technology in The Vengeance Factor to discern the concealed portions of Yuta’s face in the visual log.
Yeah, but in test screenings, the audience was disappointed when it didn’t hit him square in the face. (And when Jono didn’t beat the snot out of him. And stab him instead of Picard…)
When Jono jabs a spoon into Wesley’s banana split, ice cream splatters onto Wesley’s face, but in the shot of his face being splattered, the ice cream comes from directly in front of him, rather than upwards from the direction of the table top. In fact, in the shot of the spoon stabbing into the bowl, the bowl clearly tips over in a direction parallel to Wesley. The ice cream should fly right past his face.
(Insert your own “the writers must be bananas” joke here.)
Not a nit, just a note: in speaking of this scene, Wesley must like to eat the bananas first. There aren’t any in the bowl.
Talk about your elaborate joy buzzers
Jono stabs Picard in the chest at the end of Act 4. Crusher says in Act 5 that Picard survived because the blade hit the sternum and was deflected. That’s a fine way out, but I have a cooler one: Did if the writer remembered that Picard had an artificial heart? All Crusher had to do was remind everyone that Picard’s heart was artificial, and its construction withstood the blade. Then again, I like Keith Alan Morgan’s suggestion that Jono would’ve been electrocuted if his blade did hit Picard’s heart !

he indicates that he had no youth or friends because he was too devoted to his dream of Starfleet. The episode Tapestry later contradicts this. Weren’t Cortin Zweller and Marta Batanides his friends?
Didn't he meet them AT Starfleet?
However what about the guy in Family (in charge of the Atlantis project) wasn't he a childhood friend of Picards?

Then again, I like Keith Alan Morgan’s suggestion that Jono would’ve been electrocuted if his blade did hit Picard’s heart !
I'm shocked! ;-)

Jono says, "his race" wears gloves so they don't touch "alien flesh"

Yet, when his "father" arrives, they touch each other WITH THEIR GLOVES ON.

THEN...at the end, Jono TAKES HIS GLOVES OFF and touches Picard.

Thanks for the recap of events, but what is your point?

I assume to show that Jono is touching Picard without his gloves, but wasn't that the point?

When Jono's "father" arrives, he wears gloves so as not to touch anything alien.

When Jono takes his off at the end and touches Picard, its just to show that he knows that Picard is not an alien to him, and to thank him for letting him go back to his "father".

good 1215402167106

I hardly thing a broken arm and ribs on a 16 year old is real evidence of abuse. Repeatedly broken ribs and arm maybe but a single break, he could have been in a car crash (or it's future equivalent) for all they know. People go horse riding at a very young age and people do fall over. I suppose they did think he would be abused and leaped to conclusions but they didn't seem to even consider a harmless explanation for the injuries.

There is a bit where Worf asks if it's worth going to war for a child (really he should have said teen) and Crusher chips in "you might not say that if it was your son" which brings up the point that he's none for their children. The only parents he's know are the Talarians.

They did mistreat him rather surely he can make the banar and listen to him music if he's in a room alone. There was no need to totally strip him of his culture.

I was recently thinking about this episode and had a thought about it that really bugs me.

I find it bothersome that Picard lets Capt. Endar go at the end.

Endar seems to have been at the colony during the massacre and perhaps even participated in it. Even if he didn't, it doesn't change the fact that he more or less kidnapped Jono.

Someone might say that he at least had the dignity not to murder a child. However, kidnapping him, robbing him of his parents, lifestyle, home, identity as a human and heritage quite frankly is almost as bad as killing him imo. Heck, when one considers what for example, the Borg did to Annika Hanson, it could even be worse under certain circumstances.

Granted, Endar couldn't simply have left Jono there alone to suffer and/or die.

Still, allowing Endar to go free feels almost criminal and dishonours the memory of Jono's parents.

However, I accept that Jono was innocent. He was the victim in this. Forcing him to go back to the Federation would be no different then what Endar did. At that point, Jono was for all intents and purposes, no longer human.

I agree that not allowing him to do the things he's grown used to doing and forcing human standards on him is equally as wrong.

At the same time, allow Endar to go free I dunno, it just doesn't sit well with me. I do admit however that this was one of these shades of grey situations with no easy answers.

I was thinking about this recently. I really do wonder how the Talarians could ever possibly have been enough of a threat to the Federation that they were at war at some point. Presumably, their conflict took place between the time that the Enterprise-C had been destroyed and before the Enterprise-D was launched. In other words, the early part of the 24th Century.

I mean, their starships are clearly inferior to that of the Federation, weapons-wise, as well as being considerably slower. And then there is when Jono is remembering back to when his parents were killed. Was it ever established as to how powerful the Talarian hand weapons were? Granted, in "Loud As A Whisper", there were the two factions on the planet that both had weapons that disentegrated the victims layer by layer, and Phil remarked that these must be some kind of "special" laser. So it is understandable that various non-aligned races would also possess powerful weapons technology. Just look at the Zalkonians, the Children Of Tama, and the Son'a!

I also wonder just when the Federation made first contact with the Cardassians, and why the confict between them started. But I shall post further about that on "The Wounded" board.

I really do wonder how the Talarians could ever possibly have been enough of a threat to the Federation that they were at war at some point.
If the Talarians declared war on the Federation & started attacking that's all that would be needed for both parties to be at war.

Yeah, I understand that. But if that is what happened, why did they do it? I already said they were technologically inferior to the Federation. But then again, so were the Cardassians. (More on that on "The Wounded" board.)

And then there's the Tzenkethi. We never even saw any of them, or any of their starships. Was it ever established when or why that happened?

Boy, am I full of questions all of a sudden or what?

Well, since there is little canonical info to go by any number of explanations could work: they mistook a Federation survey as an invasion; they discovered a Federation colony on a planet they had claimed; they saw the Federation as weak; etc., etc.

As for the technological differences, well, maybe it wasn't as lopsided during the war, or maybe the Talarians just underestimated how powerful the Federation was, but once war was declared their culture wouldn't let them back down?