I saw this movie today. A few thoughts: First, while it was mostly enjoyable, with some really funny moments, I'm not sure if Dreamworks animated movies are up to the level of the better Disney ones in terms of writing. The movie seemed like it dragged on a bit, especially in certain scenes, like the one where Shrek first compares himself to an onion.

My main gripe with this film was the ending. It was total B.S.!! What a cheat! First, they rip off "Beauty and the Beast" by using those rays of light projecting from Princess Fiona's limbs, just like they did with the Beast's at the end of "Beauty." Then, what happens? NOTHING! She remains the same! Now I knew what they were trying to do: They were trying to play with our expectations, knowing we'd think she'd be turned into a human, and tried to throw us off. They were also trying to say that one's inner being is a truer measure of beauty than their outer appearance.
Fine.
Have one of this movie's writers get into an auto accident that disfigures their face, and tell me they don't mind, so long as they have a girlfriend.

The reason this is such bilge is because unlike Shrek, who is an Ogre,and presumably always was, Fiona was not. She was a little girl when the spell was placed on her, and to say she has to accept such a radically different appearance, one she considers so unattractive, is bogus. She accepted Shrek as her love, and didn't care that he was an ogre (at least not at the end), so why couldn't they just have her and Shrek, a human and an ogre, get together, in order to show that two different types of people can be together, without saying that both have to be ogres or humans?

This reminded of an episode of He-Man and the Masters of the Universe that I thought was offensive and hypocritical. It was one that was supposedly about how people should be judged by their actions, and not thier appearances. He-Man had to ally himself with a race of humanoid insects in order to stop Skeletor from destroying Eternia's oxygen supply. They, of course, were strange-looking, and they felt the same way about He-Man, thinking he was quite disgusting-looking, but He-Man didn't judge them, and one of the insect people was open-minded enough to help He-Man. By the end of the episode, the Insect Guy underwent a chrysalis and metamorphosed into a much more human-looking butterfly being. He said this must be what his people all go through, and must tell them. During the bit at the very end of the show in which they have to EXPLAIN the message to you, which I believe was narrated by Teela, the redheaded female, she spoke of judging people by their actions, not appearances, and referring to He-Man's alliance with Insect Guy, she pointed out that in the end, his "true beauty showed through," and said this as a clip of Insect Guy's emergence as a human-clone played. Gee, I wondered, wasn't his beauty "showing through" when he helped He-Man stop Skeletor? Wasn't that, I thought, the whole point? Yet, here they were, saying that beauty could only show through if these Insect People looked just like humans. I wonder just what his people thought when they found out they were all destined to turn into a bunch of ugly humans. What would YOU think if you found out we were all going to turn into insects? It was an insulting and hypocritical message.

The writers of "Shrek" made the right move in not turning Shrek into a human, but did the converse instead, turning Fiona into an ogre.

So what was the whole point of that spell anyway, if she ended up staying the same? Shrek could very well have NOT kissed her and she would've stayed human, at least during the day. Now she's an ogre, as Donkey puts it, "Twenty-four/seven."

THE NITS:

Why did Lord Farquad want to round up fairy tale characters?

Why, if Farquad wanted to do this, did he dump all the ones his men captured into Shrek's swamp?

Where did that cabin come from that Fiona slept in during the second night of the trio's journey to Farquad's castle?

I felt the same about alot of this movie. The movie message hits you like a slegehammer.

My biggest thing with the moive is that they tried to make it for both kids and adults. And when you do that to a moive the humor fails in both places. Either they should have made the movie for kids and keep it clean, ot they have should have made it for adults, took out that blantaly obvious message, and made it more fun. Even the original fairy tales weren't for kids.

I'm don't think making a movie for all audiences is impossible, Meg. I think Disney does it all the time. I loved "Beauty and the Beast", "Aladdin," "Tarzan" and the "Toy Story" movies, and so did kids. You can put elements into stories for one audience, and other elelments for another, or in some cases, certain elements are not age-specific. A lot of the humor in the Disney films is universal, and once in a while, they'll slip an in-joke or something in for people a bit more saavy. "Toy Story" seems fairly friendly for kids, but Potato Head's line "What are YOU looking at, ya hockey puck?!" to an actual hockey puck in Andy's room from the first movie had greater meaning for those who know that Don Rickles, who did the voice, is famous for using that line. If it's done right, I compare it to putting castor oil in a baby's orange juice. The kid doesn't know it's there, and doesn't have any reaction to it one way or the other. The alternative is stuff like "Power Rangers", which only kids can really love, and which has no redeeming values for adults.

And by the way, Lord Farquaad's name is spelled as such, with two "a"s. I just found that out today.

The "disney poke" was a fun moment when Shrek and Donkey entered the castle. The giant Farquaad man's running through the queue is cute, too.

Also the Eddie Murphy remake of the Monkees I'm a Believer at the end was good ... wouldn't even mind owning a copy of the song ...

In the first night, when Fiona is looking out at Shrek and Donkey, from what little we can see of her face, she still looks human, not like an ogresss. It's not green, it's flesh colored.

Once more, I'm so proud to have raised a nitpicker daughter! -- ScottN

The cabin on the second night was the windmill seen earlier in the movie as Shrek and Donkey were leaving Disn...er... Lord Farquaad's Castle. Also, my 5 year old sister brought up a good point. At the end of the movie, she was explaining it to us, as she usually does. She said that Fiona was ORIGINALLY an ogress and that the spell that changed her form changed her into a human during the day! Just a thought.

Sorry, Merat. If that was the case, Fiona would not have been so self-conscious about her appearance as an ogress, particularly toward Shrek. Why would she have to hide her appearance from Shrek when turning into an ogress? If she originally WAS an ogress, than when turning back into an ogress each night, she'd be like, "Oh yeah. Look at me. You KNOW you want me, Shrek! Come to mama!"

Instead, she's worried that SHREK will think that she's ugly. My original nit stands, as my reason for thinking why that ending was total B.S.

That's another nit. Why does she think Shrek will think she's ugly? He's an OGRE, for cryin' out loud. He'd probably think she's better looking that way!

Perhaps she had encountered humans during her incarceration, or the journey from her home to the castle where she was imprisoned and these humans reacted favorably to her human guise but not her ogre form. In the same way some people will try to change their standards to be more like those around them.

Scott, didn't I just say that? But hey,thanks for agreeing with me!

"In the first night, when Fiona is looking out at Shrek and Donkey, from what little we can see of her face, she still looks human, not like an ogresss. It's not green, it's flesh colored."

I thought that too when I first saw it. However, on a second viewing I paid more attention to that scene. Those wiley creators actually cast Fiona in shadows and only showed a close up of her eye. Her skin was slightly greenish and mostly obscured in darkness.
They did an awesome job with this scene because they show so little of Fiona that you see her eye and imagine her as though nothing has changed.

On second viewing I also noticed that the mirror tries to warn the king immediately but he blows it off. Kudo's on the forethought.

He's a Prince not a King.

Great running gag: "He's Overcompensating..."

No, hes a Lord.

Uh, excuse me, but I'M a "Lord."

Excuse me, Mr. Christ, did you just escape from South Park?

I think the exact title for Mr. Christ is "Lord of Lords" ...
(but who's counting ...)

Have one of this movie's writers get into an auto accident that disfigures their face, and tell me they don't mind, so long as they have a girlfriend - Luigi Novi

Well, what's the point of looking attractive if you've already got a girlfriend/boyfriend? Trying to get one is the only reason to want to look attractive.

Not necessarily.

I agree with Luigi's assessment of the film's conclusion. It *is* bogus.

The movie's intended message is anything from never judge a book byu its cover to (as Luigi pointed out) one's inner being is a truer measure of beauty than one's outer appearance.

but instead the movie's message comes across as there's an ugly person for everybody.

That's a nice moral, Mikey

Now if only someone would make a movie about Garak's version of The Boy Who Cried Wolf...

By the way, I agree with Luigi - the writers gave us an illogical, but preachy, "message."

Even though Donkey has hooked up with Girl Dragon, here are two messages I picked up from this film:
Stay with your own kind (vis-a-vis Shrek and Fiona Ogress).
And everyone is beautiful and worthy of respect -- except short people.

The problem is that I picked up the theme "Physical differences don't matter," i.e., initially Fiona and Shrek and Donkey and Dragon.

Of course, the movie contradicted this with the ending.

I had no problem with the "message" of the film being somewhat shaky, because I decided not to look for a message. To me, the message was just, "Let's make fun of Disney!" And since the woman never ends up ugly, the movie had some fun with Disney-based expectations.

Nits:

The fairytale creatures say that they were relocated to Shrek's swamp by Lord Farquaad's command. So why is Farquaad interrogating the Gingerbread Man to find out who's harboring them? (Loved that scene, by the way.)

Near the end, a fairy godmother turns an onion and the three blind mice into a carriage and horses. Yet a few minutes later, the three blind mice are dancing on the organ keys, as mice, and shortly thereafter we see the carriage moving away, still being drawn by the same three blind mice in horse form.

Hmmm. Good point, Duke.

Luigi, I'd just like to lend my support. What Richie described does not seem like grounds for banning.

Thanks, Josh. I really appreciate your saying so.

I've emailed Phil about the matter, and I would suggest that any who wish Richie replaced as moderator do the same.

Will do!

Duke of Earl Grey,

Good point on the message!!

I've got some anti-nits for Luigi. First, they tried and failed to move Shrek out of his swamp. Since the Ogre won't come to the concentration camp bring the concentration camp into his swamp.

Duke, I've got a potential anti-nit for you. I've only seen the movie once, so I may be wrong. Did Farquaad interrogate the ginger bread man before or after all the fairy tale creatures ended up in Shrek's swamp? (And was that all? Snow White and Sleeping Beauty [or was it Cinderella -- Eh, some blonde] are fighting for position at the bouquet toss. Shouldn't there be more? Can't someone say he means the ones the haven't caught yet?)

He interrogated him after, I believe.

Perhaps Lord F. ordered them to be killed, and the kindhearted soldiers simply dumped them into the swamp, rather than execute them. This is a farie tale, in a manner of speaking.

Then when Lord F discovered that they were still alive, he tried to find out where they were located, so he could finish the job.

Well, I get ya, that that scene with Fiona and the rays of light, remenisciant of the Beast turning into a human, would seem like a gip, considering it didn't do anything to her, except keep her an Orgre. Think about it, she was a human by day, and an Orgre by night. The kiss, and the rays of light made her one 24/7. The magic performed the ritual of her staying that way. I guess it was nescessary to tell us that that is what happened. Even Fiona said she doesn't know why she isn't beautiful. It had to take Shrek to say so. It didn't take long for her to agree.

BY the way, I believe she was human when the spell was cast upon her as a child.

Lord F moved MOST of the fairytale creatures to the swamp, but he was looking for those that escaped & in hiding when he interrogated Gingerbread Man.

I noticed that some of the fairytale creatures in the swamp were the 7 dwarfs with Snow White.
But then, when Lord F is using the mirror to search for a princess he is shown Snow White.
He had a princess in his kingdom, but he kicked her out.

As far as putting the creatures in the swamp, William Berry's "concentration camp" scenario doesn't make sense because you can't have a concentration camp simply by dumping people there; you have to put walls or fences and guards around it to keep them there. Otherwise, "ghetto" seems like a more appropriate term. Jason's "kindhearted guards dumped them there" answer isn't bad, but the movie should show us that happening.

As far as the nature of the spell, SlinkJ is right. During their second night on the journey, when Donkey discovers her secret, Fiona says she was a little girl when she had the spell placed on her, and added that every night she turns into this ugly hideous monster. If she were an ogre, she'd say "I'm this ugly pink-skinned freak during the daytime." She wouldn't hide from a fellow ogre at night, nor would she ask "Why aren't I beautiful?" when Shrek's kiss failed to turn her into a human.

I believe that when Fiona talks with donkey about the spell, she said that she was been cursed "as long as I can remember". The writers did a good job with the wording of the curse. It could have been "You will turn into an ugly monster at night" but instead it was "One way by day, another by night". She assumed that the day time look was loves true form because, like the rest of us, she knew all about sterotypical fairy tales. She did, after all, expect Shrek to slay the dragon and carry her out of the tower to his noble steed.

Three more nits:
1. Lord F has to choose from one of three princesses. But, if memory serves, Cinderella and Snow White were not princesses until they each married a prince.

2. When Shrek, Fiona, and donkey are close to the castle grounds, Fiona starts to convince donkey that he is ill. Her motive is to get the others to stay there because the sun will soon set. However, Shrek joins her in the con. What is his motive? Shouldn't he be thinking 'Why is Fiona trying to con donkey?'

3. Shrek overhears Fiona and donkey talking about being ugly and being a princess, and he thinks that the conversion is about him. The next morning he confronts Fiona and tells her that he heard every word. So now she thinks that he knows the truth about her. However, at the wedding she acts like she is finally revealing her secret to Shrek. To Shrek, it is a revelation, but she shouldn't be thinking that is a surprise to him.

I thought the 'rays of light' effect during Fiona's non-transformation was SUPPOSED to be seen as a rip-off of Disney's "Beauty & the Beast." (One of this film's least subtle jabs at Disney.)
By the way, Christopher Q, good point about Fiona buying into stereotypical fairytails.

Lord F has to choose from one of three princesses. But, if memory serves, Cinderella and Snow White were not princesses until they each married a prince. - Christopher Q

Last time I spot a nit and think "Oh, I'll send it in another time."

Although your nit is only half-valid. I think that in the usual version of the story Snow White is the daughter of a Queen.

I would like to add one more moral/message (and forgive me if it's been pointed out before):

Never judge a person by their exterior... unless they're short. Then, you're perfectly justified in ridiculing them.

Just after the 'rays of light' shot, most of the windows in the cathedral shatter in a most spectacular fashion...rather like the end of the film 'Highlander.'

When I saw this movie, it immediately reminded me of a Knights of the Round Table story I read once. In that one, Sir Gawain meets Lady Something-or-Other who has the same general curse as Fiona in Shrek. Gawain does the usual rescue-and-marry thing, and on their wedding night, the lady tells him that he gets to choose whether she will be ugly at night and beautiful by day, or vice versa. Gawain (having earlier had several lessons about this) lets her decide what she wants. Then she tells him that because he did this, she will be beautiful all the time now. When Fiona's curse was revealed, I could pretty much predict the outcome.

One thing that bugged me about this movie (which I otherwise loved) was Fiona-Ogress thinking herself as ugly. Donkey agreed that she was very ugly. Why? Well, she had little hollow horns for ears, but that wasn't so bad. She was green, but then, so is Shrek, Kermit the Frog (feel free to burst into song here), not to mention Orion slave girls and the girl from "Lost in Space." So what's the problem? Oh, yeah. She's not just green with odd ears, she's (Drumroll) FAT! So of COURSE she was ugly! Never mind that her face was the same, just a little broader, with the same pretty eyes.

Dr. Banner could have used the material she used for her dress, which expanded at need without getting ripped up.

I loved the scene where Fiona paused in mid-martial-arts leap in order to smooth back a loosened lock of hair. However, considering that she has been guarded by a dragon, why did she need to learn self-defense, and who taught it to her?

I didn't watch much of the Oscars, but I did see "Shrek" win. I loved the special effects they used, especially Billy Crystal's character from "Monsters, Inc" pretending to be a good sport about losing.

I liked the fact that Shrek fell in love with Fiona before he ever saw her other persona. I think he would have been happy to take her as is, if Fiona had been willing.

One of my little nephew's favorite part of this movie was the karaoke scene with Donkey singing "I Like Big Butts."

One of my little nephew's favorite part of this movie was the karaoke scene with Donkey singing "I Like Big Butts."

Nit: That's "Baby Got Back."

Never judge a person by their exterior... unless they're short. Then, you're perfectly justified in ridiculing them.

Hey! :P (I'm 5'2, or thereabouts..)

Shrek 2 is coming soon, I believe next summer. I saw a teaser poster in a movie memorebelia catalogue... the poster shows a big green numeral 2, with Shrek antennae sticking out of the top of it.

Absolutely favourite bit -

Farquaad's guard smashing the hand mirror to get the Magic Mirror to talk.

Always makes me chuckle.

You should be worried about a sequil where all of the people who worked on the first one didn't come back because they did not like what the studio was doing with their script.... Don't really have any hope for the next one which is kind of good.